Jack's - Morris - Special

[Mihun09]

So, when laying out the layers of glass before wet out, I did notice the weave seemed much tighter than the first build. It also smoothed out better and during wet out I had no issues whatsoever with wrinkles forming at the sheer. It could be the boat design but I'm thinking the glass was more flexible, if such a thing exists. It even wrapped the stems almost half way down before I had to slit it lengthwise. I was able to wrap around the edge as well so I need only put a thin strip to cover the remaining stem.

It is 6oz, I have no idea if it is E or S, just what the store sells is what I get, only the one option. I do think the tighter weave is what made it more difficult to flood the two layers, although I have not done two layers previously so have no history to go from. The one fill coat I did last night is smooth on the bottom so it may not take many more coats to be smooth, but pigment coverage will be a factor likely on how many coats I use.

Jim, Alan, everyone, how does this compare to what you use?

 

[Mihun09]

At the beginning of this project I had a concept I was working with as far as finishing the exterior. As most of you know I have a 100 year old Morris w/c canoe project in the queue that I will get back to after this boat is done. Months ago when thinking further down the road to when that project gets completed I was pondering paint schemes and had an idea I thought would look good. Back in those days designs/graphics/striping were very common. With this project going to use some Morris features, I had decided to try out the design concept on this boat first. The original idea included a full painted panel from the waterline up to the gunwales with integrated stripes and designs at the ends. However, the design for this boat keeps changing as I build. The actual space between waterline and gunwales is rather small which would have limited the panel size, so the design is evolving slowly. I have dropped the end features and am putting something in the middle instead, with two or possibly three stripes pulling it all together. I have it mostly designed in my head but have the middle design ready to be cut from masking film. The striping I will pull by hand when the time comes, which likely will take a day to do both sides.

With the pigment being cream, the stripes and logo will be burgundy, albeit much more subtle now due to the design changes. It will still stop at the waterline and follow the stems and gunwales to keep it simple. I call my shop Wolf Kraft Boat Works so you can understand the design a bit more. It will face forward on both sides.

 

[Jim Dodd]

Hi Karin

Great progress ! I'd say you have 6 oz E-glass. S-glass is quite a bit more expensive especially in the wider widths. There are many different styles, finishes and weaves .

I was taught to lay the cloth on the bias. It's supposed help with wrinkles, and give more strength. So that's what I done. I can't really say any different.

I like the logo ! I've always been envious of those with artistic talent !

Jim

 

[memaquay]

Hey I just remembered I still have those brass stem bands you sent me, or ones I ordered, I can't remember, but I can send them off to you.

 

[Mihun09]

Hey I just remembered I still have those brass stem bands you sent me, or ones I ordered, I can't remember, but I can send them off to you.

Tis alright, we still have 16 feet of that flat back brass stem band. Christy got two 12 foot pieces originally so just keep what we sent you.

 

[Mihun09]

question for the stripper guru's... if I do all my fill coats on Friday, would it be sufficiently dried to remove from the forms on Sunday?

 

[Jim Dodd]

In my opinion you could. Depending on shop temperature.
My preference would be to wait a few more days.

They claim that most epoxies reach a full cure in about 7 days, if temps are 70 degrees F. The epoxy gains cure quite a bit the first few days, and then slows down.
One way to gage this is take a knife and trim the excess saturated cloth at the shearline. At 24 hrs, it trims pretty easy. 48 hrs its a little tougher, and 36 hrs it's a lot harder.

Hope that helps. I've been told that if taken off too soon, the weave of the cloth will be more apparent, in a clear coat.

Jim

 

[Mihun09]

shop temps will be in the 50's, low 60's maybe all week with the outside temperature in the mid -20's F all week coming. I already trimmed the sheer after the wet out coat. Not dealing with clear coat here at all, so that isn't an issue. I can wait a week but I'm really wanting to get it off the forms because sanding the interior could take a few weeks.

 

[Alan Gage]

Tis alright, we still have 16 feet of that flat back brass stem band. Christy got two 12 foot pieces originally so just keep what we sent you.

With shop temps in the 50's that might be pushing it. But if the epoxy feels hard (can't dent it with fingernail) I'd say go for it. I doubt you're doing to hurt the structural integrity. The worst that can happen is that it gets a little scratched up because of the non-full cured epoxy but the whole thing is going to get sanded down again anyway.

Alan

 

[Alan Gage]

Oh, and a trick I've seen used at Northwest Canoe that I'll be implementing to promote resin curing in a cold shop is to drape plastic from the shear line to the floor and then put an electric heater under the hull.

Alan

 

[Jim Dodd]

Just wondering if you were going to sand the outside, before you pull the hull off the forms ?

It seems easier to me to sand before pulling the hull off the forms. But in your case, you would be sanding uncured epoxy, and that is bad !

Looking forward to seeing your build off the forms too !

Jim

 

[Mihun09]

Wasn't planning on sanding before removal, it will need to be done before graphics go on though. I will likely do that after the inwales go in to stiffen the hull but before the outers. Still working on trim wood, hopefully I can find something we already have to save on costs a bit. Big plans, small budget.

 

[latremorej]

Oh, and a trick I've seen used at Northwest Canoe that I'll be implementing to promote resin curing in a cold shop is to drape plastic from the shear line to the floor and then put an electric heater under the hull.

Alan

I have done this with a blue poly tarp. I did notice that where the tarp actually touched the hull, the epoxy was not as hard as where there was a small air gap, possibly indicateing cold spots. I ended up putting pool noodle halves in between the hull and the tarp to create a small air space to hold the heat. It worked quite well. I had two small electric heaters, one at each end, and I filled the middle with a few 100 watt light bulbs. My 10 dollar remote thermometer read a consistant 65f when it was in the 30's. My garage isn't sealed tight or insulated.... To put it nicely. I can close all of the doors (there are no windows) and turn off the light during the day and still see enough to walk around.

Jason

 

[Mihun09]

Still waiting for the pigment, but I know it is close. UPS called to say they don't deliver to PO Boxes which makes me want to ask why they take shipments which clearly state a PO Box on the package. I can understand they need to make money, but since they won't deliver it the receiver then needs to make other arrangements including going to UPS to pick it up, which is inconvenient at it's best. I am home with an illness so will call this morning in the hopes they bring it to the house today or tomorrow so I can once again move forward.

I could go out and sand the boat, come in and die for few hours, then go and apply fill coat, come in and die, repeat as necessary... Today will be 7 days since the wet out and first fill coat so it is mostly cured from sitting in a 60 degree shop all week. If I get fill coats on this weekend I will let it sit another week before taking it off the forms finally.

 

[Mihun09]

Spoke with the UPS call center this morning, in India or where ever they have that is cheaper for them and was told that I have two options, I can have them deliver it to the house for an additional delivery fee in 1 or 2 business days, Or, I can go pick it up in Winnipeg. Mind you, the call center could not tell me Where in Winnipeg it is, so I have to wait for them to call me and tell me where it is, at some point today, up to 7pm. Tomorrow will be 4 weeks since I ordered.

I could, if I choose, remove the boat from the forms and carry on with the interior since the wet out and first fill coat have cured and structural integrity is achieved. I would then just pop it back onto the forms to do the fill coats if the pigment ever actually arrives. For today I will just wait and see IF UPS actually calls me back.

 

[Jim Dodd]

Do you get the feeling that some one's trying to tell you something ?

Honestly, when things get tough, just stay the course ! I've been struggling with my window film, and have it near to what I'm happy with. Just don't give up !
On the good side, you let your epoxy cure a little longer !

Jim

 

[Mihun09]

Ok, so UPS is a world wide courier company totally interconnected by computers so they can track packages worth much more than mine, anywhere at anytime. So I just got a call from UPS telling me that someone from UPS will call me to say where to pick up the package but it could take up to 48 hours to find the package which we all know is in Winnipeg, or maybe not, perhaps it is in transit back to Peterborough or, just maybe, it is helping to hold down the Nipigon Bridge.

 

[Mihun09]

She who whines the most, wins.

First pigmented fill coat just applied. I had a thought that a clear finished boat generally hides the flaws but with the pigment I will likely see every badly laid strip and bump that did not get faired out. At least it is a light colour, black would show everything.

 

[wysedav]

Looks great to me!!

 

[Mihun09]

It has a couple of humps in the bottom, exact same place at both ends which is weird. Right on top of the 5th station mold. It isn't like I have the skill to duplicate a flaw perfectly, lol. Funny about this boat, the V from the stems carries back 5 stations at each end, which only Mem could say whether that helps it track better.