My Perfect Solo River Canoe

[Idiot Savant]

I’m researching high volume solo canoes with responsive, not tippy hull designs. My NC 15 is a fine boat, but a little heavy for my new upper carriage situation. To be honest, it was a load before my injury. I could handle it, but it was tough to load on my car and flip in some landings. It weighs 54 lbs as I have it decked out. I’d like to shave 10-15 lbs off, and still have a hull that will work with shallow, fast streams.

One candidate is the Swift P14, but I’m not sure if the expedition Kevlar would hold up, and perhaps the rocker is not adequate on this model. It certainly has the capacity for me and the mutt, though. Just a place to start.

This gives you an idea what I’m looking for. Weight, hull durability, and responsiveness are the primary search criteria. I prefer a bench seat and foot brace. Any help sorting through the prospective canoe models would be appreciated.

I'm not sure what you mean by responsiveness. There is turning responsiveness and straight line responsiveness.
If you want a really stable canoe with good speed and a lot of capacity, the Wenonah Encounter would be a good choice, but a bit of a bear to turn. If you order if from a dealer, Wenonah will set it up with any seat you want. The Wenonah Prism is Piragis Northwoods Companie's number one selling solo. That should tell you something. I have a Northstar North Wind solo. Not the fastest boat, but it is pretty stable and will handle big waves and rapids better than most solo tripping canoes. Northstar's IXP layup is super tough, but adds quite a bit of weight.

 

[TimG]

Have you seen the new Nova Craft Prospector 14 Solo that was just announced? Not particularly deep for a river boat, but with 2.5” of rocker, I bet it’s more maneuverable than the Swift iteration. Comes in all the different layups/weights.

Prospector 14' Solo Canoe | Extra Responsive | Nova Craft Canoe

New for 2024! Our most multipurpose solo canoe model yet: The Prospector 14' Solo features a symmetrical hull with moderate rocker for responsive performance.

www.novacraft.com

 

[Idiot Savant]

Northstar's Phoenix could be regarded at their version of a solo Prospector.
If I were looking to buy something that can handle class II+, yet still do OK on flatwater, my first choice would be the Phoenix in IXP layup.
Cliff Jacobsen has high praise for it.

 

[Black_Fly]

Northstar's Phoenix could be regarded at their version of a solo Prospector.
If I were looking to buy something that can handle class II+, yet still do OK on flatwater, my first choice would be the Phoenix in IXP layup.
Cliff Jacobsen has high praise for it.

The bottom of the phoenix’s hull is rounder, I think, and it’s not really dog friendly. I owned one for a couple years and it was great in moving water, but too unstable with a dog that likes to look around. Might be ok if he was a lazy hound that just laid there. It’s worse if you move him behind the seat. Every shift in weight requires a counter lean by the paddler. I went to the nova craft p15 to flatten out the hull cross section. It works fine, but my shoulder is now rebuilt and I need to cut weight. The p15 is 54 lbs with the foot brace, lining holes, and skids I installed. I’d like to cut 15 -20 lbs. The NC14 in blue steel is shown at 37 lbs. If accurate that would be the upper range of where I want to be. I’d still need to add a foot brace and lining holes, eventually skids (my streams are rocky and fast). Seems like the solos in the weight range I’m looking for are lake boats. The ADK 12 or the Firebird are looking interesting in the Blacklite hull.

 

[Idiot Savant]

The bottom of the phoenix’s hull is rounder, I think, and it’s not really dog friendly. I owned one for a couple years and it was great in moving water, but too unstable with a dog that likes to look around. Might be ok if he was a lazy hound that just laid there. It’s worse if you move him behind the seat. Every shift in weight requires a counter lean by the paddler. I went to the nova craft p15 to flatten out the hull cross section. It works fine, but my shoulder is now rebuilt and I need to cut weight. The p15 is 54 lbs with the foot brace, lining holes, and skids I installed. I’d like to cut 15 -20 lbs. The NC14 in blue steel is shown at 37 lbs. If accurate that would be the upper range of where I want to be. I’d still need to add a foot brace and lining holes, eventually skids (my streams are rocky and fast). Seems like the solos in the weight range I’m looking for are lake boats. The ADK 12 or the Firebird are looking interesting in the Blacklite hull.

Northstar designs their boats so they are widest at or just a few inches below the gunnels. This gives them better secondary or ultimate stability but may reduce initial stability a bit. I have a North Wind solo that is designed that way and it seems pretty stable. Not as stable as my Wenonah Encounter, kind of the benchmark for solo stability, but more stable than some other solos I've paddled. Everything is a tradeoff, you don't get anything for nothing. The ultimate in primary stability is a flat bottom boat, but there are a lot of downsides to the design.

 

[Black_Fly]

Well, I wish I could paddle a Foxfire. In blacklite layup it seems to be where I want to be. It gives up 100 lb payload a foot shorter than the Phoenix. Cheaper to get a smaller dog.

 

[Idiot Savant]

Well, I wish I could paddle a Foxfire. In blacklite layup it seems to be where I want to be. It gives up 100 lb payload a foot shorter than the Phoenix. Cheaper to get a smaller dog.

Who makes the Foxfire? Is that an old Bell design?

 

[NikonF5user]

Who makes the Foxfire? Is that an old Bell design?

I am thinking from context perhaps he was referencing a Firebird, the smaller sibling to the Phoenix produced by Northstar. Like the Phoenix is an upsized WildFIRE, the Firebird is an upsized FlashFIRE. I have not paddled one, but as an intergrade in size between the WildFIRE and the FlashFIRE - it's a good bet that the Firebird would be an AMAZING creekin' boat!!!

 

[Black_Fly]

Foxfire is correct. It is a foot shorter than a Phoenix, 100 lbs less payload though. The black light is only a pound lighter than the phoenix. The IXP layup would be best for rocky streams. I’m liking a lot about this model except the weight in IXP (and the price ). It also won’t handle a dog. I was falling in love with the idea of a 27 lb daytripper. Might try to find a used one for spring.

 

[SouthernKevlar]

I was curious about the Foxfire that you mentioned, so I just Googled "Foxfire Canoe" and there were no results.
Who makes it? Northstar does not list it in their lineup; sounds a lot like the Firebird though.

I sure like my Phoenix.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I was falling in love with the idea of a 27 lb daytripper.

Savage River Harmony Solo (20-26 lbs) . . .

Harmony Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Touring / Freestyle - Length: 15' - Weight: 20-26 lb

www.savageriver.com

. . . or Deep Creek Solo (25-30 lbs).

Deep Creek Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Leisure Touring, Sport, Freestyle, and Wilderness Tripping - Length: 16'6" - Weight: 25-30 lb

www.savageriver.com

 

[NikonF5user]

Savage River Harmony Solo (20-26 lbs) . . .

Harmony Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Touring / Freestyle - Length: 15' - Weight: 20-26 lb

www.savageriver.com

. . . or Deep Creek Solo (25-30 lbs).

Deep Creek Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Leisure Touring, Sport, Freestyle, and Wilderness Tripping - Length: 16'6" - Weight: 25-30 lb

www.savageriver.com

I really want to try a Savage River - but holy cow they are expensive. You totally get what you pay for with SR, but that doesn't change the dent in one's bank account! The Harmony Solo in Carbon Inegra with the whitewater package would weigh around 32 pounds and be as rugged and capable a solo river tripper as anything out there, but it will set you back just over $5000...

 

[Black_Fly]

Savage River Harmony Solo (20-26 lbs) . . .

Harmony Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Touring / Freestyle - Length: 15' - Weight: 20-26 lb

www.savageriver.com

. . . or Deep Creek Solo (25-30 lbs).

Deep Creek Solo

Solo / Symmetrical - Leisure Touring, Sport, Freestyle, and Wilderness Tripping - Length: 16'6" - Weight: 25-30 lb

www.savageriver.com

Weird there is a bow seat in the Harmony “Solo.” That price must be In Canadian dollars.

 

[SouthernKevlar]

Weird there is a bow seat in the Harmony “Solo.” That price must be In Canadian dollars.

As per the Savage River website, the Harmony can be had in either Solo or Tandem. I guess the setup in the photo can do both; it has three seats (one is almost hidden by the dog).
And yep the starting prices do hover around the mid $4,000 to $5,000 mark in US Dollars. It can even leave $5,000 in its rearview mirror if you get to piling on the options!

 

[Black_Fly]

Weird there is a bow seat in the Harmony “Solo.” That price must be In Canadian dollars.

As per the Savage River website, the Harmony can be had in either Solo or Tandem. I guess the setup in the photo can do both; it has three seats (one is almost hidden by the dog.
And yep the starting prices do hover around the mid $4,000 to $5,000 mark in US Dollars. It can even leave $5,000 in its rearview mirror if you get to piling on the options!

Seems like a sweet boat and they’ve obviously put some technology into it to get the weight down. I’m liking everything except the price tag.

 

[adkjoe]

Black Fly says he doesn't want a tippy canoe. As much as I love my Hemlock SRT, I would classify its 26" waterline and rounded bottom as on the tippier end of the 15' solo canoe spectrum, especially if a big dog is going to be flopping around in it.

For Hemlock canoes, I'd recommend instead the 15'-7" long x 32.75" wide Eaglet set up as a solo canoe. It can be made as low as 36 lbs. with Hemlock's "Lite-Tech" layup, which is a high grade S-glass, Kevlar and carbon composite hull with skin coat instead of gel coat to save weight plus some lighter weight wood selections for seats, thwarts, decks and gunwales.

In fact, Hemlock has a used Eaglet 3 seater in Lite-Tech construction on the website now, listed at 39 lbs. I'm sure Dave could remove the bow and stern seats and replace them with thwarts, so as to lose 2 or 3 pounds.

Eaglet video:

I totally agree on the Hemlock Eaglet, I have the lite tech version with the green tint so it weighs in at only 38#'s. The boat does perferm really well and is super solid canoe.

 

[Idiot Savant]

From his initial post it's a little hard for me to decipher what exactly he's looking for.
My first question would be where is it going to be used?
Lakes? Rivers with rapids? Twisty little streams? All of these.
Before looking at some regional brand, I'd first look at the major players.
Wenonah, for sure. Swift, in Canada if not the US. I'm a big fan of Northstar. Ted Bell has a pretty big footprint in the industry.
My first choice for a canoe for running rivers with class II rapids would be the Phoenix.
My first choice for a Boundary Waters boat would be the Magic.
For twisty little streams, maybe something a little shorter.

 

[ppine]

All of the solo canoes are tender compared to a tandem.
I would not paddle anything with less than a 32 inch beam.

 

[NikonF5user]

All of the solo canoes are tender compared to a tandem.
I would not paddle anything with less than a 32 inch beam.

Sounds like you may be a candidate for an Old Town Pack...

 

[billconner]

All of the solo canoes are tender compared to a tandem.
I would not paddle anything with less than a 32 inch beam.

Does that rule out the Echo at 31 7/8"?