I am 98% sure that I will be epoxying the gunwales. The material is much thinner now for the outwales and inwales so I think the best for this situation will be to bond with epoxy. I definitely do not have enough clamps for this technique though. C Clamps are expensive. Will spring clamps do the trick in the non aggressive bend areas? If so I will pick up about a dozen C Clamps and utilize the spring clamps that I have on hand as well.
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My First Canoe Build
- Thread starter dcloots
- Start date
I am 98% sure that I will be epoxying the gunwales. The material is much thinner now for the outwales and inwales so I think the best for this situation will be to bond with epoxy. I definitely do not have enough clamps for this technique though. C Clamps are expensive. Will spring clamps do the trick in the non aggressive bend areas? If so I will pick up about a dozen C Clamps and utilize the spring clamps that I have on hand as well.
Home Depot has 2" Spring clamps at $1.00 a piece.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/ANVIL-2-...9691/302755764
These work great for these "Jimmi" clamps as Cruiser has Named them ! For gunnel work you really don't need the inner tube.
http://www.canoetripping.net/forums...ons/diy/77273-new-spring-clamps-for-stripping
https://www.homedepot.com/p/ANVIL-2-...9691/302755764
These work great for these "Jimmi" clamps as Cruiser has Named them ! For gunnel work you really don't need the inner tube.
http://www.canoetripping.net/forums...ons/diy/77273-new-spring-clamps-for-stripping
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I recommend screwing. I epoxied the gunnels to many hulls before I finally screwed on a set. I couldn't believe how quick and easy it was to screw them! No mess, no stress, and relatively few clamps required. Just give the inside of the gunwales a coat of epoxy before securing to the hull to seal them from water that will get in that crack
I used stainless wood screws. Probably #10 but I don't remember for sure. Get them as long as you can without poking through. There was nothing local so I ordered from Mcmaster Carr.
Alan
I used stainless wood screws. Probably #10 but I don't remember for sure. Get them as long as you can without poking through. There was nothing local so I ordered from Mcmaster Carr.
Alan
I'm a screwer too. If at some point you need to replace your gunwales, it's a lot easier just to take the screws out.
Gunnels that are screwed on Will need replacing sooner, than those that are glued, and used in the same conditions.
Yes gluing is more work, the first time. I can make a business replacing screwed on gunnels. The glue seals the gunnels. Moisture that gets between the hull and gunnels ? Rots the gunnels !
I'm replacing gunnels right now on a Mad River Kevlar Tandem.
You can do it either way ! I'd guess All wood gunnels are screwed on by Commercial Manufacturers. It's a lot faster.
Jim
Yes gluing is more work, the first time. I can make a business replacing screwed on gunnels. The glue seals the gunnels. Moisture that gets between the hull and gunnels ? Rots the gunnels !
I'm replacing gunnels right now on a Mad River Kevlar Tandem.
You can do it either way ! I'd guess All wood gunnels are screwed on by Commercial Manufacturers. It's a lot faster.
Jim
I have mixed feelings, not sure if I am a “gluer” or a “screwer”
Gunwales that are screwed on will survive forever if the canoe is stored properly, and if you pre-treat them in the manner Alan described. I always put a coat of epoxy on all sides of my gunwales to seal them before installation. I have replaced factory gunwales that were screwed on, and sure enough, when I took them off, the side next to the hull was untreated.
I agree with everyone who has said to make sure to use some epoxy to pre-seal the side of the gunnel that will be up against the hull. If you are oiling the gunnels, leave the other edges alone.
In addition, I applied a bedding compound called Dolfinite to make sure water and gunk could not get between the hull and the gunnel. https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=4400. I don't recall where I read the bedding compound suggestion for gunnels, but it will absolutely prevent water, dirt, sand or anything else from getting between the gunnel and the hull. The only downside was that during installation it made the gunnels want to slide around as I clamped them in place in preparation for screwing them on.
As I mentioned, I recommend silicon bronze screws, particularly if you will ever take the canoe into brackish tidal water, salt water marshes or the ocean.
In addition, I applied a bedding compound called Dolfinite to make sure water and gunk could not get between the hull and the gunnel. https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=4400. I don't recall where I read the bedding compound suggestion for gunnels, but it will absolutely prevent water, dirt, sand or anything else from getting between the gunnel and the hull. The only downside was that during installation it made the gunnels want to slide around as I clamped them in place in preparation for screwing them on.
As I mentioned, I recommend silicon bronze screws, particularly if you will ever take the canoe into brackish tidal water, salt water marshes or the ocean.
I always just use regular wood screws. They are covered by varnish and buried in wood that is covered in all kinds of crap. Haven't had any rust off yet.
The Gunnels I've replaced, that were screwed on were rotted the worse at the screw holes.
The gunnels are actually weakened by drilling screw holes.
It also makes it easier for water to penetrate and rot.
Gluing provides strength the full length of the gunnel. Screws don't !
Jim
The gunnels are actually weakened by drilling screw holes.
It also makes it easier for water to penetrate and rot.
Gluing provides strength the full length of the gunnel. Screws don't !
Jim
I have decided to glue not screw. The dimensions of my gunwales are inline with Cruisers weight reducing recommendation. I have attached a photo of one gunwales dry fitted. My question is there appears to be more of an angle in the upwards direction that I believe would interfere with the paddle stroke. I know that I will need to establish a cross brace at the center line to maintain the true canoe beam, but after just removing the center station mold to dry fit the gunwales it is very true. Gil's book only speaks to sand the gunwale tops but does not speak to perhaps altering the angle of the gunwales so that they would be more so parallel to the waterline. What is the groups consensus on dressing this angle to accommodate a more parallel appearance for aesthetics as well as functionality.
Attachments
I just round off the tops, pushing it through a router table, and let the angles fall where they may. But I'm a wood butcher too.
dcloots: My wabnaki has those same angles on the gunnels -- mine look even more pronounced because I used 3/4" stock. There's no reason to try to sand them level and it would be a bear to do because the gunnels basically have a rolling bevel or angle. Just soften the edge. It won't interfere with paddling and it looks good, imho. EDIT: I believe but am not certain that the angle is the result of the hull's tumblehome.
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Taken last weekend by someone I didn't know. I was taking out and loading up the car and the photographer asked if he could take pictures of my canoe. I said, sure, just send me the best shot! This picture was one he sent me.
You are getting there fast DC ... looking good, i just finished my gunnels tonight .. .. so we are at almost the exact same point.
Brian
Brian
I have been staring at the gunwales for hours contemplating my next move! Laying out seat placement, yoke placement and trying to determine if I should only go with one seat. I think I am only installing one seat at this point. Taking measurements for equipment...such as a Yeti and canoe packs. Taking all the measurements and continuing to think about it.
Since I have made the gunwales 1/2” I believe I have committed to installing cleats. Your example was epoxied directly to the hull if I am not mistaken. Is it possible to beef up another strip at the seat location and epoxy that strip to the existing gunwale. Wondering what strength would exist for placing seat hangers on an extension piece beefed up on the gunwale. Seems like it could possibly be a weak joint but then again maybe I am underestimating the power of epoxy again!
Best of luck to you on your finish as I am sure you will be done long before I am done as all I am doing is staring at it......for hours!
Even with two seats, there's plenty of room for a big cooler, packs and even a dog.
You aren't committed to cleats, you can just put a 1/4 strip in where you want to put the seats, just just go a little past either side where you want to hang them.
I will post a few pics when I get a sec, I am just starting a raid in WoW atm ... but I will post tomorrow morning I figure.
Brian
I will post a few pics when I get a sec, I am just starting a raid in WoW atm ... but I will post tomorrow morning I figure.
Brian
I will be doing that in more detail for the current build, but you have the right idea of just adding a bit to where you want to hang the seat(s). I use a saturate with unthickened epoxy, then butter with thickened epoxy approach to adding the pad out strips. There are pad outs for the thwarts as well.
You can see them here on my Freedom 17
View attachment vyPjz5Q1ooCqn91c6IRQn6LYnDdfhVC4-4AbEcp-wQgb7UCHD9aGRWDVx3F90CoBGY_pm9X2N5fqj-o5ZapvmkJZuLYQ-ELHbAzS
So you aren't locked into cleats, although after installing them on my last build, I am also planning them for this build, they just seem a lot cleaner and the gunnels are also clear.
Brian
You can see them here on my Freedom 17
View attachment vyPjz5Q1ooCqn91c6IRQn6LYnDdfhVC4-4AbEcp-wQgb7UCHD9aGRWDVx3F90CoBGY_pm9X2N5fqj-o5ZapvmkJZuLYQ-ELHbAzS
So you aren't locked into cleats, although after installing them on my last build, I am also planning them for this build, they just seem a lot cleaner and the gunnels are also clear.
Brian
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