• Happy National Pfeffernusse Day! ⚪🇩🇪😋

Mad River Monarch

No Title

Hey Mike, I found this pic of a 2004 Loon with hull reinforcement...have you been in this one? Seems I saw one with a black diamond shaped carbon piece installed, but I may have just dreamed of that or something. Anyway, small world as you have paddled the Sea Wind in my garage...
 

Attachments

  • photo2630.jpg
    photo2630.jpg
    135.6 KB · Views: 2
Hey Mike, I found this pic of a 2004 Loon with hull reinforcement...have you been in this one? Seems I saw one with a black diamond shaped carbon piece installed, but I may have just dreamed of that or something. Anyway, small world as you have paddled the Sea Wind in my garage...

The carbon Loon that came through the shop had no reinforcement laid in the floor. Although it oil canned slightly in choppy waves it was a marvelous boat. I especially liked the Navigator Rudder that slid instead of clanked into the housing when retracted. I didn’t have the Loon long enough to know whether that peculiar rudder design would become finicky clogged with sand or debris or need parts refreshed or replaced (see Smart Track tales of woe)

I’ll be very interested in what you think of the Sea-1. I loved that boat, and not just because it looked sexy as heck. It is different in design and concept from the Sea Wind and needs to be appraised on its own merits. I thought it was a hair faster than any of the Sea Wind, Loon or Monarch, and a rough length-to-waterline ratio seems to hold that true.

Joe, when you get the Sea-1, do tell.
 
Hung up.. Something is sticking in the rudder track. OEM rudder track.. It must be sand and grit or something. The track has been lubed. Its all black and ooky. What to clean it with and does it need relubing?
It kept hanging up mostly on one side in strong seas on Newman Bay in Newfoundland which made an interesting trip.
 
Hung up.. Something is sticking in the rudder track. OEM rudder track.. It must be sand and grit or something. The track has been lubed. Its all black and ooky. What to clean it with and does it need relubing?
It kept hanging up mostly on one side in strong seas on Newman Bay in Newfoundland which made an interesting trip.

If you get a definitive, or even agreed upon, answer on rudder track lubricant please let me know

One thing I do know is that blasting the tracks with a hose jet spray while moving the slider rails back and forth is the place to start. Whatever grit, sand, shell shard, debris is in there needs to come out before lubrication the slide. Black and ooky doesn’t sound good.

One thing I believe helps in a preventative way is to sponge any water (and grit) out of the hull before flipping it upside down on the roof racks (or in camp), so that the residual water isn’t carry the dirt, sand and debris from the bottom onto the tracks. I am no angel at that, especially at the tired wanna-get-going end of a trip when I often just heave a boat on the racks and get a bilgewater dousing. Attesting to that I have boats on my storage racks with sand aplenty still adhered inside.

I know that when I jet blast the gunwales on my open canoes the amount of crud that sometimes shoots out is between amazing and disgusting, and that track slider is just as likely a dirt trap.

One thing (among many) I do not know is the most effective lubricant. I have used a variety of products, with varying degrees of success.

WD40. OK, I don’t use that. I mentioned it only because I think WD40 is near useless in most applications, and it is definitely sand attractive. The only thing WD40 has going for it is advertising and universal availability.

Silicon spray. Works well enough, at least at first, but the slipperiness doesn’t last long and if it is too freshly/thickly applied it will collect sand. Add to that I am leery of the aerosolized overspray getting into anything I might need to repair.

Armor All. A product I dislike for almost every other application, because I know it makes stuff slipperier than snot on a door knob. My Armor All sprayer dispenses milk-like splatters, so I have sprayed it on a cloth and cleaned/lubed the tracks with that.

Armor all seems to provide pretty good, lasting glide, and less sand attraction than silicon spray. That may be attributed to having heavily sprayed the tracks with silicon vs wiped them down with Armor All. A lighter coat may be better. 303 might work as well or better.

The most sensible recommendation I have read is to use a dry lubricant, and there are dozens of those from bike chain products to auto brake parts stuff.

Googling “rudder pedal lubricant” is not recommended unless you have an hour, two beers and a sense of humor about suggestions to use everything from candle wax to WD40 to nose oil. Some of the wet lubricants, especially the petroleum-based stuff, is questionably for long term use on plastics.

There is no consensus to be found there, but this stuff seems like the best dry spray candidate. Teflon Non-stick dry-spray lubricant:

http://store.tmcindustries.com/DuPo...z_p_145.html?gclid=CLq0vaOy5ccCFYEYHwodgtIBFA

I couldn’t find it available in the usual Home Depot/Lowes/True Value vendors so I ordered a can on-line.

A couple of the decked boats have freshly lubed pedals, and a couple yet need some cleaning and attention. I’m thinking a dry lubricant would best go on a non-oily surface, so after blasting and cleaning the pedals in those boats will get Teflon Spray.

Kim, I am not a big fan of that OEM rudder pedal track and slider. Beyond the non-adjustability of the pedal length of that kinda crude 30 year old design of tracks and slider rails seems unnecessarily long, and their position, with vertical pedals hanging down from the cowling/deck, seems ideally located to capture dirt and sand left in a wet hull.
 
Took the rails out.. Hosed everything down.. took the rails apart.. Hosed everything down.. Mineral spirits dunk. Dried then went at it with microfiber cloths and q tips. Didn't put any lubricant on. I know WD 40 is great at attracting dirt ( from using it on kayak paddle ferrules, I never will again..nothing more fun than spending three hours and getting four people to play tug of war.

We may try the bike chain lubricant if the nothing approach doesn't work.. Totally confused, we just did nothing except clean.
 
Took the rails out.. Hosed everything down.. took the rails apart.. Hosed everything down.. Mineral spirits dunk. Dried then went at it with microfiber cloths and q tips. Didn't put any lubricant on. I know WD 40 is great at attracting dirt ( from using it on kayak paddle ferrules, I never will again..nothing more fun than spending three hours and getting four people to play tug of war.

We may try the bike chain lubricant if the nothing approach doesn't work.. Totally confused, we just did nothing except clean.

Did the ooky black develop after the mineral spirits dunk? Maybe the mineral spirits didn’t react well with the rails and solvent softened something (say that fast three times).

A coat of some lubricant definitely makes a difference in the stiffness of the rudder pedals. And maybe in the glide of the SS cable sliding through the tubing sleeve as well; I have squirted a bit in either open end of the tubing sheath (as is recommended) and worked the cables back and forth for easier movement..

I have high hopes for the Teflon non-stick dry film and will let you know what I think. We have some bike chain lube spray and I may experimentally try that on a boat as well.
 
Ooky was the conditon of the mechanism when it was taken apart. Cleaned with mineral spirits. Boy was it full of sand.. I have yet to find the bike chain lube spray.. Its hiding..
 
Took the Monarch out 2 weeks ago up to the ADK onto Lake Lila. It held a ton of gear which I liked. Picked up a Fox Worx 270cm kayak paddle and had a lot of fun. Of course I still can't download pics, will have to post on a web site and add later. Why did I take it when asked by a friend and not the Rapidfire? Because I wanted to try it out and was very pleased. Even paddled well in the Shingle Shanty section. Paddled over a few beaver dams and almost tipped over but didn't.
 
Coldfeet I clicked on the link and it wont work either with the s or without after http.. Page not found message. Would love to see the pics. Its amazing that you navigated Shingle Shanty just because of the length of the Monarch.. How many Hornbecks did you wipe out?:p
 
PS we stayed at site 16, beautiful site. I was also surprised not to see any rangers paddling around for the 3 days there. Did see a bald eagle in the NorthWest section but took that pic with my phone.
 
Thanks! Now both you and I ought to get some derections on how to make a utility thwart. That wide space in front of our knees begs for use.. Map holding. compass, drink etc.

Maybe the Derelict Prince ( he is too modest to be King) can help us with a DIY utility thwart. I would like something to attatch water bottle to and map and bailer and throw bag ( when in Canada) and to put some attachments to put a hoop on to keep the spray skirt from sagging.
 
Thanks! Now both you and I ought to get some derections on how to make a utility thwart. That wide space in front of our knees begs for use.. Map holding. compass, drink etc.

Maybe the Derelict Prince ( he is too modest to be King) can help us with a DIY utility thwart. I would like something to attatch water bottle to and map and bailer and throw bag ( when in Canada) and to put some attachments to put a hoop on to keep the spray skirt from sagging.

About half way down this page, with photos.

http://www.canoetripping.net/forums...ns/diy/30675-klepper-kamerad-ts-rebuild/page5

The only tricky part is getting the edges of the utility thwart to conform nicely to the edges of the cockpit coming, but that is just sand it a little, test fit, sand it a little, test fit, sand it a little.

The rest is just epoxy and cloth work.
 
I see Post 72 in the link.. Thank you. Good timing. My hubby has been relegated to the shop for a time with a cast on a foot(posterior tibialis ligament reconstruction).. Gotta get him in the barn and out of the house!
 
I see Post 72 in the link.. Thank you. Good timing. My hubby has been relegated to the shop for a time with a cast on a foot(posterior tibialis ligament reconstruction).. Gotta get him in the barn and out of the house!

A utility thwart is pretty easy build and install, getting the very slight ( ) curves on the edges to fit snuggly between the cowling edges is time consuming but not difficult, and the epoxy saturated kevlar felt on the butt ends fills any slight gap.

Figuring out where the utility thwart should be installed is easy. Put the seat in your preferred height position, lay a board across the coming, get it the boat and see how far away you want it. I like the thwart far enough away that I have to lean forward a touch to access it, but I’m also using a sail on it and want the sail forward of any paddle stroke range.

Deciding on what all you want installed on the utility thwart is personal. Mine are all “dressed” the same way. I want J-hooks for a deck compass, an open cleat for the bow line, a run of lateral bungee for miscelanous keepage and those vees of bungee between pad eyes on the hull and a J-hook on the thwart for paddle storage.

The latter, providing a place to secure paddle and spare paddle, is the most functional improvement provided by the utility thwart.
 
My hubby has been relegated to the shop for a time with a cast on a foot(posterior tibialis ligament reconstruction).. Gotta get him in the barn and out of the house!

What’s shaking with the Monarch utility thwart?

One largely aesthetic touch in utility thwart installation I may have failed to mention; once the kevlar felt butt ends are epoxied in place I run a bead (or beads if needed) of thickened epoxy at the thwart-to-cowling joint, so that the connection has more of a radiused curve ( than right angle L, and then epoxy the cloth or tape top and bottom.

Utility thwart evolution continues. A friend is outfitting a Pamlico 145 as a solo fishing kayak, incorporating a utility thwart. The Spirit Sail mount is in fact a Scotty rod holder base. That would be darned handy in a fishing craft, and an extra wide thwart within reach would provide a flat surface for changing lures, baiting hooks, etc.

Who knows, add a sail to the rod holder and he could troll.

I don’t fish, so angling uses for a utility thwart never occurred to me. Although I have used that desk space for sundry in-boat housekeeping chores, including slicing cheese and pepperoni for a mid-float snack.

Installing a utility thwart in a canoe is much easier. It’s just an extra wide thwart, best double hung with two machine screws per side.
 
Portaging question. We have not flipped the seat over to portage as the hull is way too stern heavy to be comfortable portaging. So he ( hubby) just carries it with the seat on his head.

Other alternatives? An elevated solo canoe yoke? I have one ..not yet tried it.. Fear the seat would still be a headbanger
 
Portaging question. We have not flipped the seat over to portage as the hull is way too stern heavy to be comfortable portaging. So he ( hubby) just carries it with the seat on his head.

Other alternatives? An elevated solo canoe yoke? I have one ..not yet tried it.. Fear the seat would still be a headbanger

The yoke on my Monarch seat is fairly well balanced, just a little stern heavy. I do have a utility thwart permanently mounted twenty-couple inches in front of the seat, which may have helped trim the hull if it was originally built stern heavy. That thwart also gives me an easy handhold to bring the bow down.

I have heard complaints of other unbalanced Monarchs, and there must be some physical weight distribution difference between different Monarch hulls. I can hazard some guesses beyond the utility thwart.

I know that MRC changed at least one part of the construction during production of the Monarch. The slotted seat hangers on later model boats were much thicker. That would not affect the balance, since the hangers are right at the seat/yoke, but MRC may have made other tweaks over the years to better balance the hull.

If a yoke balance became apparent in early model Monarchs that would be as easily factory rectified as moving the seat/yoke hangers forward an inch to a better yoke trimmed position. An inch or so one way of the other can make a huge difference in yoke balance, especially with a boat that isn’t a featherweight.

Or other construction changes. Maybe something as simple as the horizontal length of the seat hanger slots. If the beefier hangers that MRC changed to were notched an inch further back that would provided add bow weight under the yoke.

Or something as simple as the layup schedule. I have no empirical evidence, but my 1992 Monarch “seems” to be a beefier layup than some of the earlier ones I’ve seen. I now regret not more thoroughly comparing my Monarch and friend DP’s early model/skinny seat hanger version when I had it in the shop.

Next time my shop is empty I may balance the Monarch from the hanging scale strap to see where the exact balance point is, and the see how much extra stem weight is needed to unbalance it. If the balance is a matter of ounces at the extreme stems it could be anything, even the size and weight of the floatation glob.

Question: What were the production years for the MRC Monarch?

Confession: I have not carried the Monarch far or often with the seat yoke. There has not been that need; I don’t use the Monarch where I need to carry it any distance. I’d rather have an open canoe on my shoulders, a lighter one preferably, and especially one without a rudder and exposed cable ready to snag on things along the trail when I make a turn with 17 feet of boat swinging semi-tractor wide on my shoulders.

When possible I use a cart for cartop-to-water with the Monarch
 
Back
Top