Seller’s Market for Used Canoes

[Guest]

Over the past year there has been an additional challenge by folks who 'bid up' the advertised price of listed boats. I lost three canoes by having someone offer more than the advertised price between the time I contacted the seller and the time I was able to get there. Is the opposite of a 'lowballer' a 'highballer'?

Matt, and other challenges, some preceding the more recent phenomenon of Covid escapism and “highballers”.

Over the past five, ten+ years, well before the Covid business, I noticed more fellow tinkerers buying inexpensively priced damaged-but-repairable canoes. I expect there are an increasing number of older kids-raised time on their hands or retired paddlers, with repair skills developed from working on their own boats, knowledgeable enough to appreciate the value in a refurbishable classic, or in most anything except poly junkers.

We are not alone; there are a dozen or more of us just on this board, and most of my paddling friends own one or more of my rebuilds, some of which I have continued to work on over the years.

I’ll be interested to see how the recent gold rush works out, and how long it lasts. While I too think there may be a glut of used boats, and that prices may crash, I was dead wrong in predicting the effect of the pandemic on manufacturers, boldly stating something like “I bet this drives some smaller niche builders who are barely hanging on out of business”.

I thought the same would be true for some then-struggling paddle shops. It seems that builders can make them fast enough, paddle sport shops and outfitters can’t keep get enough of them or keep them in stock, and their 2021 pre-orders are going sight unseen pre-deliver fast.

Carnac the Magnificent I am not (reference for older paddlers).

I haven’t been to a big-box store in a while. Do they have the wire bins of Sun Dolphins standing on end displayed yet? Missing the boat there if they don’t.

 

[Waterdog]

I'm considering selling a Dagger Reflection 17 and/or Reflection 15 in RX. I will debate that to myself this weekend on my next walkabout. They are potentially taking up space for other boats that may see more use. They come in handy sometimes though. But this thread is troubling! I am thinking about purchasing an IXP Phoenix for the sole purpose of putting through a hypersonic beat down on PA whitewater (re: crunchy rocks everywhere) in order to provide this awesome board with some more real world documentation. Maybe even dig out a gopro to document the sight and sounds. I'm going to check in with RRO about what they think the availability is for the IXP phoenix in Fall 2021. If I jump at that, at least one Reflection has to go for room, I'll give CT members first dibs...I don't do ANY type of social media or Craigslist. No wonder the fat-bike I want is back-ordered until Thanksgiving!

Cheers,

Barry

 

[Guest]

Maybe we'll get you to build a stripper yet.

Never. Gonna. Happen. I’ll be on Facebook first.

See how smart I was to buy up all those used canoes when I had the chance?

Pete, for a while I was keeping a list of used or damaged boats come and gone, everything from a Dagger Caper to an OT Rushton. 25 or 30 boats, most now owned by friends and none* that I really want back.

*OK, maybe the OT Ruston, 10’, 18lbs. Spotted in the rafters while I was looking at a couple beater Grummans for sale, my sons learned to solo in that wee boat before I long-term loaned it to a friend for his kid. He essentially destroyed the gunwales, which were an open bottom channel of (light) 1971 era glass with a foam insert stiffener. The Rushton almost fit inside his van, and he repeatedly crushed it while slamming the rear door.

I fixed it. Fixed being no-idea-what-I’m-doing, inserting pre-bent 1x2’s into the old, decayed foam insert gunwale void, filling the gap and holding that wood in place with (a couple) caulk tubes of construction adhesive.

It was a solid repair. And it weighed almost 30 lbs.

I passed it along to another friend for his kids. It’s probably toast by now, but I’d love to make up for my ignorance and disrespect by re-repairing that little canoe and finding another kid home for it. Even have some age appropriate nieces/nephews in mind.

There are only a couple boats I wish I had back, even if just to work on again; the OT Rushton is one of them.

 

[yknpdlr]

You gotta get lucky. I recently found a pristine 14' Hornbeck on CL at a town in eastern NY where a good friend of mine lives. I immediately sent him to check it out and he verified it didn't have a scratch on it. I got it for $400. It is worth at least 3 times that amount and It now it rests at my lakeside camp garage awaiting ice out. The seller was already car in driveway loaded and leaving for Florida that very day ( minus the canoe).

Add me to the "never Facebookers forever".

 

[Alan Gage]

Never. Gonna. Happen. I’ll be on Facebook first.

Didn't figure. I was kind of serious about the Monford boats I linked though. Requires next to nothing for tools and skills other than patience. Not much time or money involved and you get a unique boat. I made mine to give to a 10 year old.

Personally I really didn't like the build process but that's mostly because it was broken into so many small steps (steam, clamp, wait for wood to set. Glue, clamp, wait for glue (multiple times)). I like a project where I can absorb myself for 4 or more hours if I want to. This was more like a 1 hour here, 20 minutes there, type of deal.

https://www.canoetripping.net/forums/forum/general-paddling-discussions/diy/18315-quick-sof-build

Alan

 

[dcloots]

Needing to offload some watercraft, just before the snow started flying, I introduced my son to advertising and selling on Facebook Marketplace. He took pictures, provided the specifications of each craft and handled the buyers inquiries and transactions. He sold my Native Watercraft Ultimate 12' hybrid canoe/kayak, 15 Mad River Tahoe, 10' Perception Kayak, and a 10' Jon boat with 3.5 h.p. motor in no time at all. After these vessels were no longer in my arsenal things looked a bit different so luckily I stumbled upon a Chestnut Chum that I purchased last Sunday. The chum will require restoration and I look forward to that challenge. I paid $400 dollars less than the asking price for the Chum so there were no "High ballers" during this transaction. I thought for sure that would happen so the transaction was purely with digital money via Venmo and I secured the sale. A few days prior there was a Chestnut Bobs Special that I lost out on. I contacted the owner and presented my offer. I then went back to doing some carpentry around the house and three hours later I noticed that I received a message 10 minutes after I had originally sent my offer stating my offer had been accepted. The message also stated that I needed to contact him by 7:30pm or it goes to the next guy. Well I was an hour and a half late and the Bobs Special went to the next guy. I guess everything happens for a reason. The Chum is the canoe that I had a stronger desire for anyway. In summary the canoe / kayak or "anything that floats" market is definitely crazy at the moment. My selfish thoughts bring me to next Spring and Summer where normally a paddling trip in absolute solitude may be realized to be something different due to congestion of the waterways. We shall see.

 

[frozentripper]

Algonquin Outfitters' and The Portage Store's used canoes are no longer available for sale or appointment once ice-out begins in Algonquin... there still are about 25 composite Nova Craft canoes, 2nd grade and demos available in London Ontario at the factory outlet store but no Nova Craft lifetime guarantee and you might have to actually be there at the store to buy one and it may be some work to find one in the seconds pile. IIRC there is a pond there for test paddles. Some of these may be keeled, but check before going... described as discounted boats but they aren't discounted by much. Some Tuff Stuffs included, not sure if they're keeled.

https://www.londonspaddleshop.com/discounted-boats/

 

[frozentripper]

PS.... very few new canoes in the store right now possibly an indication that demand is high. Or maybe production has stopped because of COVID 19. My guess is that people have been locked in all winter ordering gear and there will be an insane mad rush to get on the water once the lakes go ice-out. Routes will be wall-to-wall canoes, long lineups at ports...

https://www.londonspaddleshop.com/new-canoes-in-stock/

 

[LanceR]

Hey!! There's a Lincoln fiberglass canoe with some neat custom wrinkles in it for sale on craigslist in Danville, Virginia as a package deal with a plastic canoe(ish) thing that has a neat-o internal aluminum frame running down the floor and really nice wavy hull for a mere $1200!!! I have the cash in hand and I'm on my way!!!! NOT!

And the craziness continues.

But, as I have to run to town to pick up a welding gas cylinder I had filled I'm stopping by a small estate sale that listed a Mad River canoe. Who knows, maybe lightning will strike again.....

Best regards to all,


Lance

 

[Guest]

I'm considering selling a Dagger Reflection 17 and/or Reflection 15 in RX. I will debate that to myself this weekend on my next walkabout.

I'll give CT members first dibs...I don't do ANY type of social media or Craigslist.

Barry, you could be making someone happy, and that’s good karma.

The Reflection series were great downriver/do-a-bit-of-everything canoes. I sold a 17 years ago when we first went into solo canoes, and sold a friend a three seater 16 that I doubt she’ll ever part with.

Of that Dagger series I really liked the Reflection 15 as a three seater solo canoe (or replace the other seats with thwarts). Not the fastest canoe, but a wonderful big boy tripper and moving water solo. I paddled friends 15’s several times but never had the chance to own one when a 55lb (minus 2lbs if wood gunwaled) solo seemed reasonable; might still own it if I had.

All of the Reflections were asymmetrical, shallow arch, with a touch of tumblehome

The Reflection 15 (and 17) specs:
15’ 4” long (the 16 was 16’ 4”, and the 17 was 17’ 4”)
33” beam at 4” waterline (the 17 was about the same 33”at 4” WL, but 1” wider at the gunwales, 35” vs 34”)
13 ½” deep at center (the 17 was actually ½” shallower)
Speced at 800 lb capacity with 6” freeboard (the 17 speced 1100lbs at 6” freeboard)
The 15 speced 1” of symmetrical rocker, but somehow handled moving water like it had more. The 17 was very skegged, 2 ½” bow rocker, ½” in the stern)

The 15 was mid-50 lb weight in “R-lite”, the 17 in the mid-sixties. I’m think R-lite was just the term Dagger once used for RX sheets with thicker stems and bottom, not an R-84ish acrylic outer skin like some Mohawks. Dagger’s R16 in composite oddly weighed almost as much as the Royalex version.

Both are nice RX canoes depending on the user’s intentions.

 

[Paddlinhal]

Harking back to the very first post in this thread, I have an Old Town Pack Solo stowed in the porch attic behind the air conditioner, window screens, my hoards of roughcut butternut and cherry, a Sawyer solo go-fast of some sort, the trunk full of dress up clothes, the oversized toychest full of all the best ancient board games. I tried to sell it for $300 years ago, but you'd have to pay me an extra 100 just to get it out for you. I also have a fixer-upper kevlar TW Special, gunwales removed for lightness, lovingly stored under the snow way out in the woods where hopefully a family of skunks will enjoy it. Make an offer!

 

[Cheeseandbeans]

Harking back to the very first post in this thread, I have an Old Town Pack Solo stowed in the porch attic behind the air conditioner, window screens, my hoards of roughcut butternut and cherry, a Sawyer solo go-fast of some sort, the trunk full of dress up clothes, the oversized toychest full of all the best ancient board games. I tried to sell it for $300 years ago, but you'd have to pay me an extra 100 just to get it out for you. I also have a fixer-upper kevlar TW Special, gunwales removed for lightness, lovingly stored under the snow way out in the woods where hopefully a family of skunks will enjoy it. Make an offer!

Where are you located?

Bob

 

[Paddlinhal]

Hubbardston MA.

 

[Guest]

No wonder the fat-bike I want is back-ordered until Thanksgiving!

According to national retailer tracking data “Five outdoor recreation categories saw explosive growth last year”. “Bike sales increased by 63%, paddle sports by 56%, golf sales by 51%, camping equipment by 31% and binocular sales by 22%”.

“The largest annual increase we’ve seen since we began tracking the numbers, and show no signs of slowing down as the calendar turns towards summer 2021”.

I keep looking at our canoe racks, but we only have one little used boat left, and it is so specialized that it would draw very small, niche interest.

Unused canoes or kayaks? Sell ‘em if you got ‘em.

The binocular sales? I’m guessing more people spending more time at home have become interested in bird watching; I’ve had a hard time finding large bags for the custom seed mix we use in our feeders.

 

[pblanc]

Mike, sorry for this post but I have tried to send you a PM and am unable to do so because your inbox is full. Please send me a PM and let me know how I can communicate with you.

 

[Guest]

Pete, my CanoeTripping PM function hasn’t worked in years to send or receive messages, despite emptying both in and out boxes, notifications, subscriptions, etc.

You can try emailing at
my last name (plus) paddler, no space, lower case all one word plus the usual G-mail suffix.

Thanks, message-less Mike

 

[kona]

Last year was tough but there was a good surge of deals before the freeze. Used canoe inventory is finally coming on the market now in Minnesota and apparently elsewhere, at prices that seem fair by pre covid standards, and in some cases great deals. I’m guessing the spring cleaning may be followed by a summer of elevated prices.

Last year locally, there were a few folks flipping on Craigslist. They grab up any decent deal and list it the next day for 2-3x the purchase cost, no value added. I’ve resold boats that didn’t work out for me at fair prices, sometimes including a small profit to myself, but price gouging other paddlers? Not my way. Other hand, I guess everyone needs to make a buck. Either way I hope the boats find their way into hands of new paddlers.