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Happy Apple Cider Day! 🍎🍵
GP build
- Thread starter Alan Gage
- Start date
Was very happy to find a couple pieces of cherry good enough for gunwale material. Scarfed them together tonight and also cut out the yoke, which is cherry as well. Wondering if I'll need any other thwarts on a 16.5' canoe? I guess I can wait until later and see how stiff it feels.
20151229_002 by Alan, on Flickr
Suddenly the end seems in sight but I keep reminding myself that, for me, this seems to be the slowest portion of the build.
Alan
20151229_002 by Alan, on FlickrSuddenly the end seems in sight but I keep reminding myself that, for me, this seems to be the slowest portion of the build.
Alan
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Any weight or strength penalty in cherry vs ash? Either way cherry will look very nice!
I definitely prefer cherry to ash. Ash is too white despite how easy it is to bend. I've used Cherry for gunwales, thwarts and seat frames previously. Ash can be quite heavy too.
How are you mounting the seats? Cleats or hanging 'em off the inwales? Cleats may help stiffen the boat a bit if you only go with the yoke, but for the length an additional thwart may be needed to reduce flex. Depends too on the profile of your gunwales. Beefier would help keep it all from flexing too much.
How are you mounting the seats? Cleats or hanging 'em off the inwales? Cleats may help stiffen the boat a bit if you only go with the yoke, but for the length an additional thwart may be needed to reduce flex. Depends too on the profile of your gunwales. Beefier would help keep it all from flexing too much.
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A little less weight and a little less strength according to the specs:
White ash: http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-...ods/white-ash/
Black cherry: http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-.../black-cherry/
I've used it for yokes and thwarts but not gunwales. I believe Swift and some other manufacturers use it quite a bit for gunwales. Nice looking stuff, I think it will look good on the boat.
Undecided on seat mounting. Outwales were cut to 5/8x3/4 and inwales to 7/8x3/4. They'll be planed down from there to smooth out the scarf joints.
I'll install the gunwales and temporary yoke to assess the hull stiffness and go from there. Will probably be fine with only the yoke as the boat is nearly guaranteed an easy life. Extra thwarts could be added at any time.
Alan
Thwarts, yoke and seat frames in my Swift are all Cherry.
Been working on gunwales this weekend. Epoxied the LH inwale in place and then on the right side I did both the inwale and outwale at the same time. A little more of a juggling act but it went well. Now today I just need to do the LH outwale.
20160103_001 by Alan, on Flickr
Alan
20160103_001 by Alan, on FlickrAlan
Awesome looking! The colours are kind of reflective of your chicken, was that intentional? So how did you manage to glue both the inner and the outer at the same time without having a glue storm? Great time saving step, pretty sure if I did it, I'd be sanding my hull again for a couple of days.
I was a little worried about that but it wasn't too bad. I thicken my epoxy with cedar dust and cabosil to the point where I don't think it will run but still isn't what I'd call stiff. Then I scoop it into a zip-lock bag and nip off the corner to use as a piping bag. This lets me a put a real nice bead of thickened epoxy along the hull without making a mess.
When doing both inwales and outwales there is, of course, more time between applying epoxy to the hull and getting the gunwales in place because there's more stuff to juggle. During this little bit of extended time some of the epoxy did try to sag down the hull a little (1/2") but I was able to push it back up with my finger. I could have made it a touch thicker.
The actual installation wasn't much more difficult that doing the inwale alone. The outwale didn't cause much extra grief because, when you start in the middle, only the center of it is touching the hull so you don't have to worry about it messing up the epoxy down the line. Once both pieces were clamped in the center (probably the trickiest part) it's pretty simple. The inwale is the only one that really puts up a fight.
I clamped every foot or so and then cleaned up all the squeeze out with my finger. Then I added the additional clamps and cleaned up squeeze out with my finger again, and again, and one more time just for good measure. Then an alcohol soaked rag to finish cleaning off the epoxy under the gunwales where they meet the hull. Also used the rag to clean up the globs that fell into the hull. The top will all get planed/sanded anyway do I just worried about wiping up the rough stuff.
Doing inwales and outwales at the time also seems to give more even clamping pressure since one side of the clamp isn't on the (relatively) flimsy hull.
This hull has relatively tame shear and my outwales were smaller than many use at 3/4x<5/8 with a 3/8 roundover top and bottom. The inwale is roughly 7/8x3/4 with a 3/8 roundover on the bottom only (top to be added later).
I wondered when someone notice. I was afraid my creative genius was going to go under appreciated.
Alan
Thanks for the explanation! I only glued the gunwales on the first few canoes I made. When I was making my Honeymoon canoe for my last wedding, I tried to take structure off some of my older canoes that held personal memories for me. Thwarts, carrying yokes and brass stem bands were all taken from three different canoes. However, when I attempted to take a particularly nice set of gunwales off an old canoe, I realized I had glued them on, and despite my best salvage efforts, I had to give up on them. Upon reflection, I realized that particular canoe was the one my second wife and I used the most. If I were to make a clever juxtaposition between romance and gunwale application, I guess I would say glued gunwales are pretty, but difficult in their demands, and unable to meet the challenges of new situations, while screwed on gunwales are flexible and with a regular application of the right care, can be used over and over again in a variety of new challenges.
I am currently deep in the final stages of nicotine withdrawal. Say hi to your chicken from me.
I am currently deep in the final stages of nicotine withdrawal. Say hi to your chicken from me.
Wait, final stages in just 3 days? Wow, you rock man!
I know I'd have a mess ! I dry fit my inwhales with screws. When the screws are removed, and I'm ready to glue, the screws act as clamps. I can then glue and screw the inwhale, and then glue the outwhale at the same time, with out any real juggling.
Did you use any screws Alan ?
Jim
Did you use any screws Alan ?
Jim
Tonight sanded the gunwales flush on top, glued up the decks, and made deck patterns from foam. So easy to cut and shape that stuff. It took less than 15 minutes to trace, cut, and fit both the bow and stern.
20160104_001 by Alan, on Flickr
20160104_003 by Alan, on Flickr
20160104_010 by Alan, on Flickr
Alan
20160104_001 by Alan, on Flickr20160104_003 by Alan, on Flickr20160104_010 by Alan, on FlickrAlan
Very nice Alan
So I guess you will glue in the decks? Are you going to add carry thwarts by the decks? Where do you get the foam, nice idea.?
When you glued your spliced gunnels, what did you use for glue? What glue did you use on the decks also?
I always thought a splice needed to be clamped on all 4 sides but you only clamped 2 sides with six clamps. Looks like it works well.
Thanks for the detailed posts and pictures, even though I don't build strippers I learn alot for my wood canvas and non wood canoe rehabs from these builds.
When you glued your spliced gunnels, what did you use for glue? What glue did you use on the decks also?
I always thought a splice needed to be clamped on all 4 sides but you only clamped 2 sides with six clamps. Looks like it works well.
Thanks for the detailed posts and pictures, even though I don't build strippers I learn alot for my wood canvas and non wood canoe rehabs from these builds.
Correct, decks will be glued in. They'll be cut slightly wider than the hull so that I have to spread the hull to get them in place. That way the hull provides some of the clamping pressure and it's not trying to pull away from them its whole life. No carry thwarts, I'll cut an arc at the ends of the deck for a handhold. The foam is just regular construction foam. These were scraps left over from different projects. Same stuff I used for my carbon over foam thwarts.
I used epoxy on the gunnels and Tightbond III (waterproof) for the decks. Before clamping the gunnels I brushed on a little epoxy to let it soak in and thicken just a little, about 15 minutes, before adding a little more epoxy and clamping to ensure there wasn't too much squeeze out.
I temporarily clamped it on all 4 sides. First I added two clamps to draw the joint together but of course the height of the boards was quite a ways off. So then I used a squeeze clamp to bring the top and bottom flush. Then I removed that squeeze clamp and added the remaining clamps you saw in the picture. A light pass on all sides through the planer finished it off though it would have been easy enough to plane and sand by hand as well.
I feel the same about watching you guys do your wood canvas rebuilds.
Alan
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