Phoenix Speed

[Black_Fly]

No wind yesterday. Opaque water was still. Got out early to beat the heat. I decided to leave the double blade in the car, did the entire loop with my bent shaft ZRE Whitewater carbon fiber paddle. I paddled my Blacklite Phoenix. Water is still high in the reservoir and backwater areas.

I used an app to gauge both effort and progress without adverse conditions. The phoenix is fun to paddle (without a dog). It turns effortlessly. My best rate was 21 minutes per mile using the sit and switch approach. J stroking was 5 mins slower, and hurt my shoulder paddling on the left side only. I might have been faster using a straight shaft paddle while j-stroking.

The light weight of the Phoenix makes loading and carrying easy. No need for a yoke at all, although the shoulder did sore up a little, it’s the “good kind” of soreness mostly.

I tried using the double blade last time I did this stream and was able to go at a 15 min/mile clip. There was some minor wind that day, however.

I’d love to use the Phoenix on the Little Miami River, but the rocky sections can be brutal. Looking for other places to explore with this little boat.

 

[sailsman63]

That looks like the type of water like to explore.

 

[SouthernKevlar]

I love my Phoenix for exploring the local rivers and lakes, but I have never used it with the thought of speed. It is too much fun as a "paddle, observe and think" kind of canoe IMHO.

If I want to go fast, I get out my Grasse River Classic XL. It is a fun speedster and functional as a fast solo tripper. Even at 16'8" it comes in at around 25 pounds, around 5 pounds less than my BlackLite Phoenix!

Canoes are FUN!

 

[Black_Fly]

Always good to know what a boat will do if asked. My leisure trips on windless days are typically over 30 minutes per mile. It not really “wanting to go fast” but learning how to best do that if the occasion arises. The other thing is paddle choice/length. While the ZRE was perfect length in the P15 tandem, it feels a little long in the Phoenix. It does switch sides effortlessly, however. Given the cost, a new CF paddle is unlikely. Just gotta get used to it.

 

[eckilson]

I have a whitegold Wildfire that is pretty comparable to your Phoenix (6" shorter, 1" wider at the gunwales and waterline). I can paddle it fast for short bursts, but I don't think of it a a particularly fast boat. I never paddle it with a double blade, or even a bent shaft, so maybe that is part of it.

If I want to go fast, I get out my 16' Capella sea kayak.

https://flic.kr/p/2q29At3

Plastic and it weights a ton, but in terms of speed there is no comparison to my canoes. It is so much easier to go fast, and maintain that speed for distance in the kayak. I guess every boat has its purpose. Even so, I spend a lot more time in the Wildfire than the Capella.

 

[Black_Fly]

I don’t advocate fast paddling, folks. It’s just part of getting to know a boat. I’m still playing with seating, paddles, ballast, etc.

A lean and pressure on the foot brace will actually turn this little canoe. I’m kinda looking forward to some moving water play.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

If I want to go fast, I get out my 16' Capella sea kayak. . . .

Plastic and it weights a ton, but in terms of speed there is no comparison to my canoes.

The 12" max beam waterline of a 30 lb. outrigger CANOE, paddled with a canoe paddle, is much faster than a sea kayak. No need to switch sides and wind won't affect it because there's a rudder. It's a rocket going upstream. Self rescue is easy; no roll required. Portage is simple on one shoulder with a pad.

You should buy one, Erik, to expand your eclectic paddling addiction horizons. I know where there's a highly customized, used one in great shape available.







Sorry for the tangent, Black Fly, but half the topic was speed.

 

[Alan Gage]

When I used to paddle regularly I often paddled for exercise and liked going hard and fast. I almost always carried a GPS to track my speed. That didn't mean I always paddled hard but it was nice to know that I could and it was nice to know how fast I could travel under different conditions/exertion levels.

More than once on a trip I've used that knowledge.

When making long open water crossings I can calculate pretty accurately how long that crossing will take. That knowledge, combined with the current weather conditions (and possible weather on the horizon) help me determine whether to go for it or to wait/find a different route.

When weather clears in the middle of the day after being stuck in camp I use it to determine if I should paddle to the next likely camp site or stay put until morning. If it's currently 3:00 and I want to be off the water by 7:00 and I know that I can easily maintain 3.5-4mph for that period of time then I also know I shouldn't have any problem reaching my destination that's 12 miles away.

And the ability to put the hammer down and paddle hard comes is very handy when a sudden strong head wind pops up and you need to reach shore. Or when you're paddling upstream and need to ascend swifts/rapids. Skipping a portage by powering up a small rapid is a great feeling. Sometimes it's just straight power but it often involves water reading and paddling skills as you jump from eddy to eddy and cross ferry back and forth.

Alan

 

[Black_Fly]

Sorry for the tangent, Black Fly, but half the topic was speed.

No sweat here. Heck, I’m wondering if I need an outrigger canoe.

 

[gumpus]

Nicely put Alan. I agree that it's good to know what you and your boat are capable of so you can get a good match to your paddling conditions and personal preferences...and to help decide if you want to try to outrun some kayaks.

I think the Phoenix under discussion is excellent for ascending short rapids because it's happy to accelerate to a relatively high speed for short bursts plus it has the maneuverability to adjust your line or sneak around tight corners in current.

I remember paddling with a friend where we had to fight a strong headwind to get back to our put-in. The Peregrine could barely make progress and a little water was spitting over the bow. The SRT could not make progress but the boat and paddler stayed dry. Peregrine was much more fun in those conditions.

When paddling upstream into current in the 4-5 mph range by staying near shore, hiding behind obstacles, and crossing to stay on the inside bend then at some point more-efficient lake boats are no longer fun if they feel dicey when crossing a river or you know it's just a bad idea to cross an eddy line. A river boat can be fun under those conditions but you have to resign yourself to a shorter paddle since you won't be covering 12 miles upstream.

 

[eckilson]

The 12" max beam waterline of a 30 lb. outrigger CANOE, paddled with a canoe paddle, is much faster than a sea kayak. No need to switch sides and wind won't affect it because there's a rudder. It's a rocket going upstream. Self rescue is easy; no roll required. Portage is simple on one shoulder with a pad.

You should buy one, Erik, to expand your eclectic paddling addiction horizons. I know where there's a highly customized, used one in great shape available.

I've thought about it, but when I looked a few years ago there were none around. I would have had to build it from a kit, and that's not for me. I think I'll work on my sea kayak skills for a while. ;-)