Moose Bow Canoe ripped in 2

[Odyssey]

Some people do really, really stupid things; some people do unwise things, and some people do things normally well but beyond the ability and skill of others...and then crap happens. There are always other people who sit on this river bank and have the luxury to judge who is who and to which group we'd never be a part of. I'm sitting on this river bank too but have at times been in all those groups, so I'll pass on my luxury, thanks. Sorry if I'm sounding judgemental, I'm just trying to say that what starts out as fail - safe fun can quickly turn into a no - fun fail. Loss of pride can be an education. Loss of property can be an expensive lesson. Loss of life is a tragedy undeserved. My sympathy goes out to all concerned.

Interesting that I've concerned myself with potential injuries on trips, but I've never thought my canoe might be unrecoverable. I'll think twice now about what I stash in the bulkheads.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Another word of caution: There is now a bridge out on the road into Spencer Rips so if anyone is attempting any sort of rescue, better have an ATV. This is also a consideration when traveling the NFCT.

Spencer Rips:

 

[yellowcanoe]

Not the bridge that is newly out. That one has been out for as long as I know.
About 10 years ago we camped on that far side of the road. Sure nuff a truck or six pulls in on the other shore and the party started

Still thinking of the drowning in the Saco that was in a safe stretch two weeks ago. Wasn't last Sat. And two Marine Patrol people in a rescue boat that hit something and ejected them. One will probably die . The woman that drowned was terrified of water had never been in a canoe yet her partner was ok and so was she with not wearing a PFD.

Might be time to call for mandatory PFD wearing . That would be another thread. So far we have lost a dozen paddlers and boaters since ice out a month ago

 

[lowangle al]

So far we have lost a dozen paddlers and boaters since ice out a month ago

That's crazy, is that in Maine only, and is that typical?

 

[Abenakiregion]

Ever since hurricane Irene the Saco has changed dramatically. Now it only takes an inch or so of rain, as happened the night before the accident, to create some very pushy water. Add the occasional sweeper, and cold water and a novice paddler can get in trouble in a hurry. The canoe liverys weren't renting canoes that particular day.

 

[yellowcanoe]

That's crazy, is that in Maine only, and is that typical?

I don't know about everywhere else but there is a fanatical fishing population and the water now still is barely 50. We've had a lot of cold weather and rain

 

[Canotrouge]

Spencer Rips:

You see in that video, lots of things are wrong... None of these boats have flotations, most of them have gear that are loose in the boat( tie down gear act as flotation). None of them have painter rope, they don't even have grab loops. People don't seams to have much of a clue how to paddle in moving water...

It is all education, we teach moving water and ww courses, we educate people the fundamental of proper boat outfitting for moving and ww application! When we go out with friends, we are strict on PFD'S, flotation, painter ropes, throw bags, first aid and repair kit and extraction kit. I always have a DB with all the above plus a good quality agressive teeth folding saw(silky) and this bag is always in the boat. If my boat get pinned and I can't get to that bag, there is at least one other kit like that in our party.

The keys stays at the truck hidden some where and I make sure that at least one other person in the party know where it is!

We have a spare paddle per boat, bailler/sponge. We usually cary a SatPhone with us since up here there is no cell service outside of town or the communities.

Preparation goes a long way in limiting the risks of accidents, padding courses, swift water rescue courses, first aid courses, having a plan, having a trip "leader", knowing where to pull the plug and leaving you ego at home, practice practice practice.

crap does happen even when you do everything right, but at least, when you are "prepare", you can deal with the crap when it hit the fan!!

 

[memaquay]

The "tie-down" thing has been a source of great ruckus on a variety of canoe sites over the years. I think the consensus for lashing gear in is that it depends....for instance, our rivers in Northern ON are almost all pool and drop. Lashing gear in prevents quick canoe over canoe rescue, or so the argument goes. If stuff comes out, one will almost always find it eddying out below the rapid.

We used to always lash in with our club until we started using barrels. In the few tips that we have had, barrels have never exited the canoes. Perhaps we just got lucky. Anyway, lashing in is like one of those monumental topics, such as peeing in the river and putting the tarp inside the tent or under. Topics best to be avoided!

 

[Grandpa Paddler]

... lashing in is like one of those monumental topics, such as peeing in the river and putting the tarp inside the tent or under. Topics best to be avoided!

Amen Brother!

 

[yellowcanoe]

X2
The Moose is definitely pool and drop
I don't think I'd want to tie in gear on it especially when there is wood in the water to snag a boat. Worst case the gear will wind up in Attean Pond

 

[Canotrouge]

X2
The Moose is definitely pool and drop
I don't think I'd want to tie in gear on it especially when there is wood in the water to snag a boat. Worst case the gear will wind up in Attean Pond

Ok, let's forget about the gear( even if I think that a boat full of gear properly tied in will float higher and be lighter than a boat full off water...)

But the other points are valid points and important. Believe me we se a lot of people leaving Whitehorse on the Yukon river all summer long that have no clue of what they are doing. The outfitter that rent them the gear don't really care if they make it or not.... The Yukon is pretty mild, no rapids to talk about other than 5 Fingers and even that is pretty easy to get through... But it is a big river and if you fall in, could be a long swim to shore in pretty cold water...

 

[yellowcanoe]

I've done both rivers and the comparison is invalid. Not tying in on the Yukon is hoping the gear lands on a gravel bar before it gets to the ocean

 

[Canotrouge]

I've done both rivers and the comparison is invalid. Not tying in on the Yukon is hoping the gear lands on a gravel bar before it gets to the ocean

I'm not effing comparing the two rivers. I'm not even talking about tying gear or not(read the first sentence in my post)!! I'm talking about the rest of the stupid unprepared stuff going on in all the videos about the run of that riffle that people down there call a "fall".

As for the Yukon river, I live on the river!!

 

[Paddlinhal]

Spencer Rips:

The point I was making about the bridge being out: It's the crossing of Whipple Brook, about 3 miles from the river. Since there is no longer vehicle access to Spencer Rips, recoveries become more complicated. That solves the partying yahoo problem, but Scott could have had the option to end his trip there.

 

[Abenakiregion]

No Title

Canotrouge,
Calling a particular set of rapids or rips a "fall" is a local, albiet, confusing nomenclature. On the East Branch of the Penobscot the runnable sections are called "falls" whereas the unrunnable sections are called "pitches". You certainly would not want to try running Grand Pitch.
Dave

 

[riverstrider]

Canotrouge,
Calling a particular set of rapids or rips a "fall" is a local, albiet, confusing nomenclature. On the East Branch of the Penobscot the runnable sections are called "falls" whereas the unrunnable sections are called "pitches". You certainly would not want to try running Grand Pitch.
Dave

And even that convention is not reliable. There are three "pitches" on the Rapid River in Maine that are all runnable.

You look at it, you make a judgment, and you deal with any consequences. That's about all one can do. Given the condition of Scott's canoe after his tango in Mosquito Rips, I'm pretty impressed that he was able to put it back together with nothing more than duct tape, gorilla tape and a few hundred feet of rope. Not sure I could have done that. I wasn't born with a handy man gene. I amazed myself with my idea to use a swiss army knife awl and some zip ties to repair my gunnels. I never think of that crap.

-rs

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Canotrouge,
Calling a particular set of rapids or rips a "fall" is a local, albiet, confusing nomenclature. On the East Branch of the Penobscot the runnable sections are called "falls" whereas the unrunnable sections are called "pitches". You certainly would not want to try running Grand Pitch.
Dave

Maine does have some unusual nomenclature, but I think Grand Pitch has been run for many years.

I agree with Canotrouge that the rapids on the Moose Bow trip are fairly trivial. In the pictures I've posted Mosquito Rips looks to be a 2- at most, Spencer Falls a 1+ at most, and both look as if they would wash out at higher water levels.

Paddling encompasses a diverse set of skills. A competent paddler on flat water may be challenged in moving water and totally incompetent in heavy whitewater. Having trouble on the Moose Bow rapids surely can be evidence of a lack of moving water experience, judgment or skills. Or some very bad luck.

BTW, where are you guys seeing pictures of a damaged "Scott's canoe". That Facebook link posted earlier doesn't take me anywhere.

 

[Canotrouge]

I guess I got lost in translation with all the different names for river classification lol... For me a fall is when water is moving vertically... lol

 

[Canotrouge]

There is stuff being run in canoes these days at water level that a lot of people think it would/should be unrunnable https://vimeo.com/219381679

crap can still happen and it is part of the risk inherent to paddling, but I still think that if you are at least prepared and have practiced your skills you have less chances of running into troubles!!

 

[yellowcanoe]

Conversation goes nowhere when swearing and judgment starts
Later