​Eric Sevareid on double blades in canoe

[Guest]

So until you know the history of southwestern big water river tripping and done shots of Tequila out of your wife bikini top below Lava Falls rapid at 47k you have no place to comment haha

Ah tradition. Like drinking a beer out of a stinky river bootie after successfully completing an epic swim.

About beer traditions. I have a collection of beer cans from trips on my office shelves. Full beer cans, labeled on the bottom with place and date. I try to have one full can left over at the end of every trip, as a trophy signifying that I had my wits about me when packing.

Celebratory canoeing traditions probably go back past the Voyageurs to native paddlers.

Splashing Bear must drink tiswin from dirty moccasin.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Paddles? We don't need no stinking paddles!

Funny that modern double ended polers and traditional single ended polers don't have these discussions. Just sayin'.

Tomorrow, I will be double blading it (if I can ) in a rec yak. If all goes well, I will progress to double in the solo canoe. Some time later, I hope to get back to the single blade. The pole will probably not be an option for quite a while.

Hmmm...no - I won't go there.

Whatever gets you on the water without smoke and fury is all good.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Hope you can! You haven't lost as much time as I have. Rain snow, ice wind cold. I am too much of a wuss to paddle in 30 mph winds at 21 degrees though it be bright and sunny for once.

http://www.americancanoe.org/?page=Historical_Pictures

Note Ladies Poling( I think.. looks more like jousting). Double blade in a traditional canoe. The 1952 pic of Frank Havens is just scary.

 

[JagDaddy]

In MT it was PBR in the SW more than likely it will be Tecate. Savy trippers all know that Tecate cans are thicker and thus more durable than domestic cans and don't get pin holes in them by week two all dumped loose in a drop bag haha by then you can't hardly read the cans anyway because the muddy water rubs the labels off :- )

My 'happy to be alive' Tequila celebration only differs in that they take the foot out of the bootie :- )

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I came across this in Canoeing With the Cree and had to share:

“Ahead of us we could see among the bobbing breakers a canoe with two men. Bucking the waves directly we caught them. They used double-blade paddles and we tried them for a short while, but gave up in disgust. On a smooth lake I suppose they are all right, but it rough weather they are unwieldly and in a rapid, of course, they would mean suicide”.

If Sevareid canoed only with the Cree, I doubt he saw that tribe use double blade paddles. However, I would defer to Murat (and my misplaced Adney & Chapelle) on that point.

More importantly, let's focus on what Severeid encountered, which was apparently two men in the same canoe both using double blade paddles.

I would submit that even in the modern era's tragic, kayak-centric milieu of the Domination of the Double Blade, it is very unusual to see a tandem canoe propelled by two double blade paddlers. And this is still so, I venture to say, both for traditional CanAm open tandem canoes while touring and tripping and for decked tandem canoes when running whitewater. Severeid was likely of the very reasonable opinion that two double blades in a single open hull could become klutzy and uncoordinated in heavy wind, waves and technical whitewater.

Tandem kayaks and tandem "pack canoes", which are sit-on-bottom crafts designed for double blades, will of course feature two double blading paddlers.

Similarly, modern era solo paddlers in open canoes quite commonly resort to double blades, which can be due to to lack of single blade skill, lack of single blade experience in wind, waves or rapids, lack of single blade confidence in certain paddling conditions--or, to the contrary, simply because of an aesthetic or functional preference for a double blade.

However, in my experience, most open canoeists who occasionally or even usually use a double blade when solo will, like Eric Severeid and his partner, even today revert to single blades when paddling tandem in a traditional open canoe. So, I don't find his opinion--under the circumstances he encountered--to be controversial by the paddling standards of any era thus far.

 

[JagDaddy]

I've read 'Canoing With The Cree' several times first time in the 70's. While it's a good book I've always thought thier river tripping skills were pretty sketchy haha

As far as tandems and double paddles go, my wife and I had an 'Easy Rider' for quite a few years and yak paddled it for awhile till we went single blade for better white water control. I'll post a picture of it when I get some 'real' internet, it was an interesting tandem decked canoe. I kind of wish we still had, it would be fun on these SW rivers :- )

 

[Alan Gage]

Welcome back, Glenn!! Missed ya.

Alan

 

[memaquay]

Yes, long time no see Glenn! Alan's happy to see you back because after you convince me to buy something, he knows that I'll end up sending it to him. How's that rusty Mora working out for you Alan?

 

[Muskrat]

In MT it was PBR in the SW more than likely it will be Tecate. Savy trippers all know that Tecate cans are thicker and thus more durable than domestic cans and don't get pin holes in them by week two all dumped loose in a drop bag haha by then you can't hardly read the cans anyway because the muddy water rubs the labels off :- )

My 'happy to be alive' Tequila celebration only differs in that they take the foot out of the bootie :- )

I'm my experience tecate also looks most similar to a can of coke if you're drinking a beer while driving down a long lonely southwest highway. If you're into that sort of thing anyway.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Rummaging in canoe history again.. While it would seem unnecessary for two paddlers in a tandem to use double blades as modern hit and switch serves the same purpose lo and behold, on page 216 of John Jennings book "The Canoe" there is a drawing of a race of Mi'kmaq birch bark canoes in 1881 in Halifax harbor. The paddlers were Brits ( not natives) and were using double blades bow and stern. Another photo p 226 shows a solo canoeist in a high kneel position using a double blade.

Now if you think double blading a canoe is weird today I wonder what the Natives thought!

Blame it on the English!

 

[Alan Gage]

Another photo p 226 shows a solo canoeist in a high kneel position using a double blade.

By high kneel I assume you're referring to the position Olympic paddlers use?

I've never tried it but always assumed it was basically a one side only position. Looks like paddling on the other side with either a single or double would be awkward and unpowerful. Not doubting that it was done, just trying to wrap my brain around it.

Alan

 

[MacCamper]

Most excellent to read an open and mild discussion on paddle styles. Personally, I go both ways ... but only in a canoe. Stealing my wife's oft-used phrases, "everybody gets to choose." In paddling style, I can choose to be content in what ever method is necessary I use for locomotion, and others can choose if they want to expend energy criticizing my technique, tools or attitude. I am too self focused, and my life is too short to give a dang about how somebody else gets about. That said, I am not too old or obstinate to learn a new style, and always appreciate the opportunity to benefit from another's studied ability.

Last fall, I passed my cherished copy of Canoeing With The Cree to a young man interested in canoeing and canoe camping with hopes that he enjoy's Sevareid's adventure as much as I did.

 

[JagDaddy]

First thought about the high kneel pic is, he must really know how to pack light :- )

The second thought is he reminds me of me.....in my other life. I was a post Desert Storm USMC Rifleman. I shot on the Marine Corp rifle team for years, where we spent all out efforts and focused all our attention on winning matches. We really, really didn't like to loose :- )

Then I went to war in Iraq and Afghanistan. So much of what we worked so hard on really didn't matter. At all. Of course adjustments were made and things worked out, mostly.

Sure there is something to learn from 'high kneel guy', but when you go into 'battle' a lot of those little niceties of his controlled enviroment and highly specialized gear are not going to serve you well.

That's what I meant in an earlier post by how does one quantify 'olympic' style canoeing in the 'real' world?

 

[JagDaddy]

I'm my experience tecate also looks most similar to a can of coke if you're drinking a beer while driving down a long lonely southwest highway. If you're into that sort of thing anyway.

You must have me confused with some other guy, that's just crazy talk haha

Next thing you'll do is is bring up how many beers it takes to the put in from last ice with factored in 'rigging beers' for the launch party haha

Then it's river temp beer for the next two or three weeks
:- )

All kidding aside I turned 50 this year and don't drink like I used too haha Not that I don't partake, I'm just not hitting it hard like the young guys. I do carry some traditional celebratory Tequila for the beaches below the big water, but I do my shot (where's my wife? haha) and I stay out of the bottle pass arounds :- )

Mostly I don't drink as much beer because it makes me fat and weak and I got a lot of rivers left in me!

 

[yellowcanoe]

Alan yes that is high kneeling.. Imagine that used with a double blade... wet! Or not so much.The canoe has the volume of a toothpick. I can't imagine staying upright much less paddling that way.

Not for me!

 

[Odyssey]

Last summer, July I think, I headed north to pitch in and help our son on a home project. Family and friends also came to help out that weekend. My brother and his family came too, pulling a travel trailer with kayaks on top. He set up the trailer as accommodation and shady bbq/beer garden. Good times. I'd left my canoe at home because I'd seen rain in the forecast due to arrive on the Monday, and planned to return home. The job went well and everyone had a great time. On Monday morning my brother and s-i-l invited me for the nth time to tag along north to Temagami for a few days car camping and kayaking. I finally relented and came along.
After canoe tripping for years I find it hard to adjust to sleeping in a big trailer plugged into water and hydro, in a parking spot next to a lane-way "nice and close to the pit toilets." Hmm. Anyway, raucous card games stuffed inside the trailer while it pissed down outside was fun. Card games like the weather - you win some you lose some. I showed my brother how to rig a nice tight tarp over the picnic table and fire-pit. He showed me how to set up a 30' trailer for a week's worth of living. We agreed to disagree whose definition of "really camping and living the good life" we'd choose. Another beer, another toasted marshmallow, and another story told around the fire was all it took to ease us back to peace under the pines. The next day we all went down to the beach, where we sat under umbrellas waiting out the rain shower, watching the sun glint through the storm clouds and shimmer off the dark water. As the rain let up we ran down the pebbly beach and dove in, each of us slowly swimming out to a raft beyond the swimming area buoys. Some time later one by one we all swam back to shore. As I did I turned over on my back to take in the whole sky above, turbulent clouds promising more rain to come that day. I swam along the shoreline imagining this place before the white man's harsh touch. I suddenly remembered the last time I had swam here. It was 39 years before, when my girlfriend and I had skipped our high-school graduation and hitchhiked north to spend time in canoe-country. A year later we were married. Where does the time go?
My brother and I carried the yaks down to the beach and paddled a mile or two away from the Park down the lake's northeast arm. Passing landmarks from our youth made us pause and reflect on our childhood summers spent there. " I remember that rock being a whole lot bigger than that?!" "Used to always be a float plane tied up over there." "Where did all these cottages come from?" More pondering about the slippery passage of time.
I'm not completely incompetent in a kayak, but you you'd never call me graceful. While we were paddling I couldn't help wishing I'd brought my canoe instead. I'm far happier and comfortable with a single blade and in a canoe. I may not be graceful in that either, but it does put a smile on my face.
I repeated my plea/offer to my brother "We should go for a canoe trip here in Temagami. I've got all the gear and the canoe. Meet me at my place sometime and we'll head up here together. We'll have good times. You should really give canoe tripping a try. You'll love it. What do you say?" He hummed and hawed, and asked about bringing his little plastic kayak. I explained the awkwardness of the portages and packing arrangements. "It would be far easier just to go tandem in my canoe." I'm still waiting for a response from him. We eventually turned around and headed back, but not before seeing a small flotilla of young trippers plying their way up the northeast arm towards the Park, laughing and singing as they dug their paddles in. I hoped he noticed them and the fun they were having. And what they were paddling.
As my brother and I approached the small bay and swimming area I wished once again I were paddling something else. Rounding the point we drew abreast for the few remaining strokes towards the beach, and at that moment under a grey and sullen sky I glanced over at my brother. Against a backdrop of craggy granite shores, a lush green forest, and deep unsettled waters... he smiled at me. He was happy. He looked goofily pleased with everything at that moment. I pushed aside my own selfish mood, and smiled back at him. The two goofy old brothers trudged up to the truck carrying PFDs, paddles and yaks joking and jabbing who would lose at cards that night.
He in a deluxe trailer complete with plush cushions, stereo, on board kitchen, bedroom, and kayaks neatly stowed away; me finding shelter under tarp and in tent, with my canoe as my only transport and carry-all. He'll travel, paddle and explore his way and I'll do so my own way. He's shared his with me and I hope to share mine with him. Someday perhaps we'll find some middle ground, or at the very least, come to appreciate and understand each other a little more.
But godammit he's got to get better at cards.

 

[yellowcanoe]

O my... a trailer involved along with kayaks.... Uh oh. We have departed into the depths of deprivation.
We have our Pakboat stuffed in the cargo compartment of the trailer..we are halfway to he**
But a Baker tent in a sandstorm just has no appeal for me!
Yes we are on the edge of the abyss...but at 70 i am tired of climbing out on all fours for six weeks straight to pee.

 

[Guest]

Cogent analysis as always Glenn.

Severeid and Port had seen the two double bladers earlier, at the Winnipeg Canoe Club. Those Manitobans were crazy in the 30’s.

Welcome back.

 

[Odyssey]

The difference YC is that you've sipped the Koolaid in both camps. As have I, sparingly; but my little brother living a cushy life hasn't tasted either really. I still want to drink deep from both, in different places at different times. My bucket list includes both canoeing WCPP and kayaking the Iles de la Madaleine. I'm only coaxing my brother and trying not to nag. But it's like standing in front of two punchbowls, one flavoured grape, the other orange, urging a surly kid to just try it, you might like it. He's dipped a finger in one and unsure of the other.

 

[Chip]

No Title

I often kayak with a single blade. On a kayak trip last summer with a couple of buddies, I happened to look over and see them both with single blades. Snapped a picture, because it is not often I'm with a group and all of us are single-blading it. Of course, one fellow is in a Sea-wind, so maybe it doesn't really count as a kayak trip.

I carried a double blade on a recent five-day canoe camper. I used it for about an hour.

The single blade just feels so elegant and there are so many more ways to use it. It makes me feel way more connected to the water. The double blade is drudgery. Paddle on the left, paddle on the right, etc. And in the cross wind, I end up on paddling on one side anyhow. I guess if you have a spray deck over the forward end of the canoe, it's okay, but I hate the constant dripping from the double that usually results substantial puddle rolling around the bottom of the boat.

I paddled a river clean-up on Saturday. There were five tandem canoes. One canoe was propelled by two double blades. Two canoes, the stern paddler singled and the bow paddler doubled. My partner used a double in the stern while I used a single in the bow. And the fifth tandem was paddled by two with single blades. In their defense, my team was made up mostly of sea kayakers, and they don't know any better. I can't imagine what Servereid would have thought had he passed our motley collection.

The single thing in "Canoeing with the Cree" that most impressed me was the gear list. They paddled to Hudson Bay with basically a cast-iron fry pan and a couple Army blankets.