Strap Yoke Variation

[Guest]

I am a fan of strap yokes in solo canoes, especially for roof rack to water or short easy carries. The strap yoke is always there, takes only seconds to connect or disconnect, and I can not forget to bring it as with a detachable yoke.

PC180134 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

On some heavier canoes I have replaced the suspect quick release buckle with a pair of large stainless D rings.

PC190184 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

We forgot about weighing the Live aboard Miramichi as well, or at least forgot about weighing it before we started. 110lbs was the finished weight.

PC170120 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

It occurs to me that another test was conducted while weighing the 110lb canoe. A cam strap and buckle test. Both held 110lbs worth of canoe swaying in the air.

I do not use straps for rook rack tie downs, but I have a bunch, including the buckle bumpers. These

https://www.thule.com/en-us/us/cargo-carrier/roof-basket-accessories/thule-load-straps-523-_-1031

I have SS machine screws and flange washers, etc. Next time a canoe needs a strap yoke I am going to try using a cam strap.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I like the idea of a strap yoke, at least for short carries. A few comments and questions.

As to the relative strengths of a metal D-ring buckle, a plastic quick release buckle and a metal cam buckle, only empirical testing could verify the truth. Intuitively, I would prefer the D-ring because the tightness of its closure increases with the force applied, unlike the cam or quick buckles, whose closure tightness is not changed by increased force on the strap. In addition, the D-ring has no movable "spring" mechanism to fail. I use cam straps exclusively for cartopping but I never trust the cam buckle alone; I always tie off the strap below the buckle with a few overhand knots.

How do you affix the buckle end to the hull when the strap is stowed? I wouldn't want a buckle banging on the hull while paddling or cartopping, especially a metal buckle on an expensive composite hull.

The only strap yoke gizmo I've experimented with is a 1" cam strap threaded through inwale slots on wooden gunwales. The strap is too narrow. But the inwale slots are not wide enough for a 2" strap. I can think of ways via couch potato cogitation, but I'll ask you for your practical experience: What ways would you propose for a sufficiently wide strap yoke to be fitted through narrower inwale slots? The requirement is to use the minimum length of strap possible, but more than one buckle could be used.

Here's a picture of a 1" cam strap threaded through the inwale slots on my SRT. I was using the straps for affixing a cart, not for yoke carrying, but it gives a visual picture of the slotted inwale yoke strap I'm cogitating.

(If you paste from MS Word in your reply, please turn off smart quotes so you can re-apostrophe yourself.)

 

[Guest]

I like the idea of a strap yoke, at least for short carries.

Me too, I have them in all of our solo canoes, even the soloized but still heavy Vermont era RX Explorer.

As to the relative strengths of a metal D-ring buckle, a plastic quick release buckle and a metal cam buckle, only empirical testing could verify the truth.

I have some empirical testing. Or at least Ouch My Head testing. I have had two Mohawk buckles shatter while I was under the strap yoke, admittedly with heavier canoes.

Intuitively, I would prefer the D-ring because the tightness of its closure increases with the force applied, unlike the cam or quick buckles, whose closure tightness is not changed by increased force on the strap. In addition, the D-ring has no movable "spring" mechanism to fail.

I have some empirical testing there as well. Two of our heavier RX canoes have paired stainless steel D rings. I know the webbing or machine screw will fail before the clunky D rings do.

But, even with slack left in the strap yoke, unweaving the webbing from between the Ds can be a nail breaking struggle to get undone. If you pull the webbing strap taut, with no slack, you are screwed. If the webbing has any wet stretch or dry shrink the only recourse may be to get out one of your increasingly abundant knives.

How do you affix the buckle end to the hull when the strap is stowed?

With the Mohawk style release buckle, or the double D ring arrangement, those connections just dangle there, a few inches below the bottom of the inwale. They are not in the way, and do not make any noise. With a cam strap I would probably use the buckle bumpers over the cams just because I have them.

The longer length of webbing that stretches across the hull to that buckle or D ring connection is simply rolled up and held in place under the inwale with a wrap of double sided Velcro.

NOTE OF ORDER. That Velcro restraint needs to be the first strap yoke piece put on the machine screw under the gunwale.

I wouldn't want a buckle banging on the hull while paddling or cartopping, especially a metal buckle on an expensive composite hull.

Well, lets think that one through. The short strap yoke buckle does not make appreciable noise while paddling. If I am flailing around that badly I probably have other things on my mind. Even the SS D rings just hang in place quietly.

Lets think some more. When I put the canoe on the roof racks, by myself, do not help me, I know what I am doing, I am using the strap yoke. I just leave it strapped in place across the gunwales. I will need it again when I take the canoe off. By myself, no, do not help me take the boat off, or even help untie it. I know what I am doing dammit.

I put a ladder lock on the middle section of webbing so I can secure the bitter end through that, to keep it from flapping around while on the roof racks.

The only strap yoke gizmo I've experimented with is a 1" cam strap threaded through inwale slots on wooden gunwales. The strap is too narrow. But the inwale slots are not wide enough for a 2" strap.

I have not tried a typical 1 inch wide cam strap as a short carry yoke. I have made some DIY strap yokes using one and a half inch wide webbing, and did not see any comfort difference on short carries.

I can think of ways via couch potato cogitation, but I'll ask you for your practical experience: What ways would you propose for a sufficiently wide strap yoke to be fitted through narrower inwale slots? The requirement is to use the minimum length of strap possible, but more than one buckle could be used.

I dunno Glenn. I do not see two buckles being an advantage. Then the webbing between them would be another thing to remember to bring. And not lose. I really like having the whole thing in place, permanently attached, no parts to bring or lose or futz with finding.

If a 1 inch strap yoke, permanently affixed under the gunwales, is uncomfortable on short carries, maybe a sculpted, yoke shaped length of minicel, attached to the center of the webbing strap via Velcro would be sufficiently comfortable.

That would be one more thing to bring and install, but I would hate for your Trapezius or Levator scapulae to hurt. No, I am not rubbing your aching neck!

(If you paste from MS Word in your reply, please turn off smart quotes so you can re-apostrophe yourself.)

I saw that simple solution from Goonstroke, and will eventually try. But, for you, no quotes or apostrophes, and stilted syntax.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I've been using the same removable yoke on my solo canoes for 33 years and it's still in perfect shape.

I've rarely used it for short trips from and to the magic bus because it's too much of a bother, but now I'm a lot weaker. Therefore, I want to keep rambling about a strap yoke for my wooden, slotted gunwales. My requirements are:

-- 2" wide strap along the carry length, but not necessarily at the attachment points.

-- No screws or bolts going into the gunwales or hull, and not only because I don't own a screwdriver, wrench or drill. (Only a tractor, knives, machetes, saws and other edged tools/weapons.) The entire strap gizmo must affix to the canoe only by threading -- cleanly and without folding -- through the scupper slots.

-- Minimize risk of the scupper slots cracking or breaking when force is applied to the strap.

I could accomplish all this by using 1" or 1.5" straps through the slots as attachment points, connecting to the 2" strap with plastic or metal hardware, in particular reducers, slides and buckles, as I've done for many thigh straps, including the ones on the SRT pictured above and below. (The 2" padded thigh straps are unbuckled and jammed behind the seat drops, barely visible. They connect to the 1" attachment straps on the dogbone double webbed D-ring patch with reducers.)

​

However, I have a perhaps unreasonable fear that the scupper slots could be damaged by the pull force because this is a heavy (~ 45#) canoe. Maybe Conk, if he's reading, would have an opinion on this, as he's the one who makes the gunwales for Hemlock Canoe and perhaps others.

I have thought of two solutions to minimize this risk.

First, to reinforce the scupper slot by gluing a metal strip on the inside side of the slot. This could help prevent the slot from breaking in the middle, but it might not prevent the slot from breaking away altogether at both ends.

Second, to use two adjoining scupper slots on each side to hold the threaded-through attaching straps. I'd end up with a Y attachment on each side of the strap yoke. This could be accomplished using a split release buckle:

However, I'm not sure how strong this buckle is. I suppose I could jury rig a Y connection with split rings, but then there might be the fingernail breaking tightness issue Mike raised in his last post.

Maybe I'm overthinking this scupper slot breakage issue too much. (Perhaps someone who makes scuppered gunwales could think about designing in some sort of strengthened strap slot at the yoke balance point.) Whether my Y attachments would clonk around would be another problem to solve.

In my opinion, all tripping canoes should have slotted gunwales. The uses are endless and just . . . aesthetically . . . THERE . . . to attach straps, ropes, float bags, sails, towels, sponges, gear, paddles, etc.

 

[Mason]

"But, even with slack left in the strap yoke, unweaving the webbing from between the Ds can be a nail breaking struggle to get undone. If you pull the webbing strap taut, with no slack, you are screwed. If the webbing has any wet stretch or dry shrink the only recourse may be to get out one of your increasingly abundant knives."

Mike, on your second photo showing the metal D-rings, you might try rotating them. I've used double-d's a number of times over the years, and the rounded end was always aligned with the free end of the webbing, not the fixed end. The rounded ends might be easier to separate.

 

[Odyssey]

What if you ran a 1" strap through adjacent slots of the scuppered gunnels and crossed them in the middle, forming a slight X ? Or, you could get creative with the straps placement, forming a sideways K of sorts, the narrowing in the middle a bit more comfortable for over the shoulder placement. Slip on padding.
Solid gunnels are a different kettle of fish. And I wouldn't trust buckles.

 

[Chip]

I've had two canoes that I outfitted with 1.5" webbing straps for carry. I can attest to the bump your head gets when a quick release buckle breaks under load. The canoe in question was probably 60 - 70 lbs. If you use webbing straps with quick release to carry your boat, DO NOT wear a baseball cap while the canoe is on your shoulders. That little button on top of the hat really concentrates the load when the buckle breaks and the weight of the boat shifts from your shoulder to your head!

Still needing to move the canoe after the buckle broke, I utilized a 1" tie down strap with cam lock, looped around the whole hull. This works just okay, because when the weight of the boat is on the strap, the strap squeezes the gunwales closer together and the strap gets slack, so your head doesn't have clearance inside the hull. Make sure you are not wearing a baseball cap! I don't particularly remember the thinner strap being hard on neck and shoulders.

I love the concept of the strap carry, but in practice, I've found a solid carry thwart preferable. Perhaps this is true in my current fleet because the only boat lacking a permanently mounted carry thwart has a tractor seat, with the frame of the tractor seat occupying the same space my head would occupy with a carry strap. I use a removable, hi-rise carry thwart with that one.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I have had two Mohawk buckles shatter while I was under the strap yoke, admittedly with heavier canoes.

Mike, I don't know what you mean by this term, but I don't want to use them. Could you translate into the terminology used in the pictures below. Chip is reporting failures with what I assume are side release buckles, the kind that are now in Scott's canoe.

Hmmm . . . I note that "cam" is used on sites to describe both the plastic lever buckles that are like old-fashioned seat belt buckles and also to describe the metal spring friction thumb buckles found on your typical cam straps. So, to use my own terminology, which of these do we know fail for canoe carry:

Plastic lever lock cam buckle:

Plastic side release buckle:

Metal tooth thumb cam buckle:

 

[Guest]

I remove all the buttons on the top of my canoe hats.

 

[Guest]

I don't know what you mean by this term, but I don't want to use them. Could you translate into the terminology used in the pictures below. Chip is reporting failures with what I assume are side release buckles, the kind that are now in Scott's canoe.

By Mohawk Buckles I meant the side release buckles that come with a manufactured strap yoke from Mohawk Canoe Co. I believe that Mohawk changed their side release buckle supplier a few years ago. The previous ones were from ITW Nexus.

http://global.itwnexus.com/

The new Mohawk side release buckles, IIRC, are simply stamped China. I never broke one of the ITW Nexus buckles, but I broke two of the cheap Chinese versions. I do like the idea that a metal cam lock buckle has a 600 lb capacity.

Still not sure about a strap yoke design that meets all of your slotted inwale criteria. If there exists a buckle, connection or useful strap doohickey ITW Nexus almost certainly sells it.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I don't think I'd trust plastic side release or cam lever buckles on any canoe unless it was my wet dream canoe, a sub-30 pounder. The double rings seem the best solution except for the separation problem. Mike, since you're the only one I know who has the double ring set-up, could you try Mason's simple suggestion sometime in the next couple of months before I try to make something.

Mike, on your second photo showing the metal D-rings, you might try rotating them. I've used double-d's a number of times over the years, and the rounded end was always aligned with the free end of the webbing, not the fixed end. The rounded ends might be easier to separate.

Mason, you are absolutely correct, at least in terms of every picture of double ring straps and belts I see on the internet. The free end goes through the rounded side.

 

[Mason]

Might make it easier to loosen.

 

[Guest]

The double rings seem the best solution except for the separation problem. Mike, since you're the only one I know who has the double ring set-up, could you try Mason's simple suggestion sometime in the next couple of months before I try to make something.

Mason, you are absolutely correct, at least in terms of every picture of double ring straps and belts I see on the internet. The free end goes through the rounded side.

I had always put the strap yokes on using the round side of the double D rings, as in the familiar pants belt buckle orientation.

I recall that I switched the orientation of the D rings on the canoe in the photo because I had a struggle getting the webbing free with it run through rounded side. And that was with some slack left in the webbing. With the free end through the rounded side the weight of the canoe pulled the webbing tight enough to pucker it in the D ring loops and it was a bear to get loose.

That boat is a soloized UL kevlar Malecite. The D ring hassle does not seem as much of an issue with stiffer hulls. It may be that the flex in that UL kevlar hull allows the gunwales to flex inwards a little, and the doubled ring connection self tightens with every bounce.

A strap yoke is not like a pants belt with a double D ring clasp. I do not put my belt on and strap it around my waist with 50 or 60 lbs of pressure, self tightening with every step. Walking around under the strap yoke the weight of the canoe pulls the webbing very tightly between the D rings in either flat or rounded orientation.

I like always having a strap yoke attached to a solo canoe. I do not like the plastic side release buckles with heavier boats for breakage potential. I like the surety of stainless steel D rings, but not having to tug and fiddle at disconnecting the webbing while the canoe is at the waters edge and when I am ready to paddle away.

It defeats the purpose of a fast and easy strap yoke if I have to spend more than 60 seconds bent over futzing with it. At that point I might as well have gone ahead and installed a removable wood yoke design.

I like the metal cam lock buckle idea. 600 lb capacity, not self tightening, as easy to disconnect as thumbing down the cam lock buckle.

I am back to pondering Glenns peculiar requirements and restrictions for a scuppered inwale strap yoke. Gimme a minute, I think I have it.

 

[Guest]

Back to Glenns original strap yoke requirements.

My requirements are:

2" wide strap along the carry length, but not necessarily at the attachment points.

If 2 inch webbing provides more comfort maybe use a two inch metal cam strap. Or use two inch webbing, sew the last foot length over into a double thick 1 inch wide webbing strap and find a 1 inch cam buckle with gate that opens wide enough.

No screws or bolts going into the gunwales or hull, and not only because I don't own a screwdriver, wrench or drill. (Only a tractor, knives, machetes, saws and other edged tools/weapons.) The entire strap gizmo must affix to the canoe only by threading -- cleanly and without folding -- through the scupper slots.

You said it, threading. Do you own a big sewing needle and some thick poly thread? Or are you still able drive yourself to the fabric store or Walmart.

You could sew the fixed webbing ends through the scupper slots. Take a look at how the webbing is attached to a metal cam buckle. heck, even I could sew a couple zigzaggy stitches. My needle and thread work might not look that neat. Maybe it only holds 500 lbs.

Minimize risk of the scupper slots cracking or breaking when force is applied to the strap.

use two adjoining scupper slots on each side to hold the threaded-through attaching straps. I'd end up with a Y attachment on each side of the strap yoke.

I like the idea of using two scupper holes per side to help spread the load. Back to the sewing solution. Instead of just sewing the strap yoke through one scupper hole on each side, spread the load with a Y of webbing sew through scupper holes on each side.

Time for a little experiment Glenn. Time to bring the canoe into the house and play with some of the cam straps you have handy in the Magic Bus. For starters maybe take two cam straps and run them through adjacent scupper slots on each side to form a narrow X. Or a strap over strap K.

You may have to play with scupper slot variations for proper hull balance and shoulder comfort, but that sounds like a fine way to putter away a cold winters day. Someone should have thought of that before.

What if you ran a 1" strap through adjacent slots of the scuppered gunnels and crossed them in the middle, forming a slight X ? Or, you could get creative with the straps placement, forming a sideways K of sorts, the narrowing in the middle a bit more comfortable for over the shoulder placement.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I'll get to sewing in my next post, but I keep wondering if we haven't been ignoring other buckle types, preferably metal, that have no movable spring part to break and that wouldn't have the difficult-to-release problem of double rings.

For example, why wouldn't a simple metal slide work with a double fold-over? Imagine the wooden ring in this video is my gunwale slot:

Alternatively, how about an adjustable roll pin buckle:

 

[Guest]

I'll get to sewing in my next post, but I keep wondering if we haven't been ignoring other buckle types, preferably metal, that have no movable spring part to break and that wouldn't have the difficult-to-release problem of double rings.

For example, why wouldn't a simple metal slide work with a double fold-over? Imagine the wooden ring in this video is my gunwale slot:

Alternatively, how about an adjustable roll pin buckle:

The first one is simply a metal ladder lock. The second one is a fancier ladder lock with a toothy roll pin. Either would work.

Part of my desire with a strap yoke is that it take only seconds to connect. Same with other non permanent outfitting bits. My back is toast and bending over a canoe at waters edge fiddling and fussing with outfitting does me no favors.

I appreciate things that snap in place, like the Surf to Summit back band with swivel clips on pad eyes, or bench seat cushioning that slips between two pieces of webbing, or simple downwind sails that plug into an adjustable base with no sheets or fairleads or rigging.

There may be more there than a do not want to be bending over bad back. When I get to a put in, even if no one else is around, I want to git gone is short order. If companions are taking too long to get ready I will paddle down to the first eddy and wait there. I did not come here to sit by a road or bridge.

I have sometimes sat in that eddy for an unreasonable amount of time.

Waiting for Tom and DougD. Waiting, waiting, waiting way too long. I finally paddled back upstream to check. Tom can not find his car key. Doug can not find Toms car key. I can not find Toms car key.

Doug finally found it. Toms key was a single bare key with no fob. Tom had a hole in the pocket of his pants. Toms pants were tucked inside Toms Mukluks.

The key had slipped out of his pocket, down his pant leg and into his boots. I have no idea how Doug found it there.

I probably do not want to know.


EDIT

I'll get to sewing in my next post

Let me guess, you were poked with sewing needles by an evil stepmother and saved by three spell casting bears, but if you ever touch needle and thread again you will turn into a pumpkin.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Technically, I think the video shows what are called slides not ladder locks, although ladder locks might also possibly work. No matter.

I'm not sure I understand the time objection. I thought we had generally agreed that side release buckle and cam lever buckles aren't reliable enough, and that double rings can take a long time to pry apart especially in cold weather or fat fingers. I'm trying to solve the detachment time issue. It seems that a slide, although it may take a few seconds longer to attach, may save a lot more time and effort in the detachment. A net overall time win.

I have loops sewn in straps but I don't trust myself to sew strong box-X or bar tack stitches by hand. My shoemaker does it in 30 seconds for $3. Or, Strapworks will put any kind of loops anywhere, sometimes for free.

I've thought of a way to have a strap thwart without any buckles, and which could also serve as a thigh strap. This would involve a strap with sewn loops on both ends. The strap could be affixed to one gunwale by threading the strap up through the scupper slot and through the loop. The strap would be just long enough so the loop on the other end could be dropped a quarter or half inch below a slot on the opposite gunwale. I'd then insert a some sort of wooden or metal stick or dowel through the loop under the inwale to prevent the strap loop from pulling out of the slot under load. I could even use the dowel trick on both gunwales. This would give me a removable strap thwart with no hardware at all to dangle or bangle. I would have to carry some sort of "dowel" thingamajig. Pencil? Small screwdriver? Possibly rolling up my microfiber towel. My titanium spork!!!!!!

This entire strap could be removed and re-positioned to serve as my thigh strap, which I wrap around my center seat drop blocks.

With loops on both ends, I could use the strap in camp to wrap around trees to attach a tarp, hammock, lantern, paddle, rifle, axe, machete, or turmeric barrel.

 

[Guest]

This is near necroposting, reviving a long dormant thread, but a friend is trying out the adjustable roll buckle pin Glenn suggested below

how about an adjustable roll pin buckle:

I am waiting to hear how easy it is to unbuckle the webbing after a bounce-tightening walk beneath the strap yoke, but like that idea better than using two D-rings.

Of course I still have a bunch of naked 2” SS D-rings. . . . .

 

[carpenter]

Further to this discussion - hanging loops or scuppers to accommodate a prusik hitch would work well, Adjustable option could include "G hook" that could hook into loop on one side and tighten as necessary.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

A different question about a strap yoke.

For the solo portage lift, you need to be able to grab the yoke to lift and rotate the the canoe off your thighs and to put the canoe back down on your thighs. Can you do this with sufficient grip, leverage, safety and efficiency with a strap yoke on a 60 lb. canoe?