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Gunwale Work

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Penacook, NH on a back road
I've been working on the Adirondack canoe for a few weeks now. Today I milled out gunwales. For this boat since it is going to be gently used I bought Poplar which I used on the Satan Boat with success. A lot of work to get them down from 1" to 3/4" using the planner, god I do love that tool. Tomorrow I'll give a try at a dry fit with them. There is a little bit of a sweep at the bow which should prove interesting. Now for rounding off the edges I am straying away from a router and ordered a radius plane:

https://www.chipsfly.com/product/36-500.html

I've read about these for a few years now and decided to order one. On the rebuild of the Satan Boat I used minicell and sandpaper to round off the edges. Looking forward to trying it out.

dougd
 
Hey dougd, what are the disadvantages of popular? I do some wood working, I am not an expert in any way, but I was curious about using popular with canoe construction. And what type of finish are you going to put on your gunwale?
 
You ever use a router table? I run all my gunwales through a router, biggish bit one edge, smallish bit on the other edge, done in two minutes. I would be hesitant using poplar for gunwales,if it is the same tree that we have up here in the north as it is well known to have a low tolerance for water. Having said that, it has a very high strength to weight ratio, and can be found in very long knotless boards. Be interested to see how it works. Maybe seal the entire gunwale with epoxy.
 
I was hesitant to use poplar as well on the Satan boat but with a couple of coats of spar it is holding up well. From what I've read it is considered a soft hardwood, conumdrum, but is easy to work with and when bending into place is much easier then ash which is what I've historically used. This is not going to be a tripping canoe, more of a day tripper or easy overnighter so am not worried about it. And I will be using spar varnish on them as I've been happy over the years on many different boats. I have tried oil but am not a fan of backing off screws twice a year. Personal preference.

I have a bad history with routers, have both a big one and a small one as well as a table. I am hoping the radius plane will do the trick.
 
I didn't see the link to the rounding plane earlier, stupid computer. I have a few hand planes, and very happy with them as long as I keep them sharp. Thanks for information about popular. I look forward to seeing your finished gunwales.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
I've been working on the Adirondack canoe for a few weeks now. Today I milled out gunwales. For this boat since it is going to be gently used I bought Poplar which I used on the Satan Boat with success. A lot of work to get them down from 1" to 3/4" using the planner, god I do love that tool. Tomorrow I'll give a try at a dry fit with them. There is a little bit of a sweep at the bow which should prove interesting. Now for rounding off the edges I am straying away from a router and ordered a radius plane:

https://www.chipsfly.com/product/36-500.html

I've read about these for a few years now and decided to order one. On the rebuild of the Satan Boat I used minicell and sandpaper to round off the edges. Looking forward to trying it out.

dougd

I have a similar similar plane, made of plastic. It doesn't work very well for me. I, like Mem, route my gunnels. But if I didn't, I'd use a Shinto Japanese Saw Rasp ! Hands down one of my favorite tools ! Then finish with sand paper by hand.
A lot of different ways to skin this cat !
The Shinto, is fairly expensive, I'd recommend buying just the replacement blade. It has a course and fine side. You will Love it !

Jim
 
Doug, I approve of your radius plane plan! :D

I've been using a couple small ones for years (1/8" and 1/4"). Different design than yours, but it's often quicker and easier to just grab one of those for rounding edges. I'll be interested to see how this one works for you.
 
I would be hesitant using poplar for gunwales,if it is the same tree that we have up here in the north as it is well known to have a low tolerance for water.

Confusing names but it's a whole 'nother species. Pretty much every lumber store around here (and presumably the rest of the US from what I've heard) carries "poplar". It's tulip poplar from the eastern US. I believe the heart wood of the old growth trees has a long history in boat building and is fairly rot resistant but that's probably not what we're getting in the stores. It's a nice wood to work with. Easy to machine, not too heavy, stains well, easy to find clear boards, and pretty cheap. It's used a lot by cabinet makers as a secondary wood for frames, drawers, and boxes. I've also seen some nice looking cabinets that used it as the primary wood; including this bathroom vanity and mirror I made:

20120227_004 copy_web by Alan, on Flickr

More on the wood: http://www.wood-database.com/poplar/

Alan
 
Yes tulip popular is plentiful here in Tennessee. I have 4 large ones in my yard. The Wood Database site says it's sort of not a true popular, but is related more to the Magnolia tree. Which I have one of those also. Here's a pic of my yard with two of the popular and the magnolia in the back ground. The tree on the left is about 7 feet in diameter. My wife said I should cut one down and carve a canoe out of it like the native Cherokee Indians used to do. Ha.

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The Radius Plane finally came in today, Like a kid with candy I ran, OK, strolled down to the shed and on the way grabbed some old gunwale materials. Time for a dry run. I put the old factory rounded over gunwale in a vice and went to town on it. First thing I noticed is the plane cut nice and smooth. It has a front cutting edge and then a second edge that smooths out the cut. With a few passes I then experimented with settings, Nothing more then a hex wrench to move the blade up and down on both edges/blades. It took a few tries but got it down pat soon enough and am happy as a pig in poop with this tool. And BTW the radius I cut was almost identical to the factory one, a little sanding and it will be there. Yes, it may take me a little bit longer to round off the gunwales but it beats for me using the router which over the years has brought nightmares. Besides, I'm old school and like hand tools. Here's a few pictures.
 

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I like it! What would be the best way to sharpen that concave blade? Round over a piece of oak ang glue some 400 grit wet/dry paper to it?

Jason
 
I'm putting gunwales (first time) on a wreck of a MR Explorer. I looked at Poplar, and may end up going that route, but ended up picking up some of Home Depot's cedar tone southern yellow pine treated deck boards. Had read opinions from others that SYP was adequate. I would have preferred Douglas Fir, but couldn't find any workable boards (they were all construction lumber). I'll see what condition it's in when it's dry enough to work with. But the boards were knot-free and straight. Trying to figure out how to ultimately finish/treat them in a way that will look decent with the rest of the woodwork (yoke and seats, presumably ash, all sanded down to new bare wood). I'm thinking maybe a cherry stain for all the wood. The coat the ash in urethane or varnish, and the gunwales with Thompson's? If the pine gunnels don't survive the ripping/routing/install in good shape, poplar will be my next wood. I need the boat for a BWCA trip in about a month.

For deck plates, I'm trying to figure out what kind of wood to use. I hate to put something really nice on there and immediately start chewing up the pointy ends from the pivot move used to pick up the canoe to portage it. Anybody put any anti-abrasion treatments on the noses of their deck plates? I'm contemplating a little mini dynel skid plate there. Haven't found any mention of others doing anything like that, but maybe I'm not looking for the right terms.

Completely off-topic. The hull had a ton of pine sap on it. I found mineral spirits worked best to remove that. Then I found lots of other areas weren't coming off. It wasn't pine sap, it was polyester resin. Some previous owner had sloppily applied it to the gunwales and almost everything else in a lame attempt to save the rotting wood, apparently. I can't budge it, except with acetone, which seems way too destructive to the hull (Royalex). Is my only alternative to sand it off? If I have to go that route, then i'm probably going to have to paint the whole hull, else it will be quite patchy.

Cheers.
 
For deck plates, I'm trying to figure out what kind of wood to use. I hate to put something really nice on there and immediately start chewing up the pointy ends from the pivot move used to pick up the canoe to portage it. Anybody put any anti-abrasion treatments on the noses of their deck plates? I'm contemplating a little mini dynel skid plate there. Haven't found any mention of others doing anything like that, but maybe I'm not looking for the right terms.

I think you have the right descriptive terms, and I think you may be on to something. I have the same wear areas on the tips of my deck plates, wood and plastic, especially at the stern.

With the heavy soloized RX tandems (and considerations for my blown disks) I just pick up and invert the bow end, and walk back into the yoke. While the stern deck plate grinds against the ground.

Add in loading from the rear of the truck, or the higher roofline van, where I walk the canoe up / and rest the hull on the back roof rail before ducking out from underneath, and the occasional stern banging ooopsies when I do clumsily portage down some f*$@#^g hill, and the back deck plate takes a special beating.

Better that chunk of wood or plastic than my back; a deck plate is lots easier to repair or replace.

On wood regunwale canoes I have simply* installed top mounted deck plates. I like some deck plate overhang, protecting the harder to repair/refinish outwale ends from my abuse, and to that protective end make a top mounted deck plate dimensioned a little out past the gunwale edges.

That deck cap, secured atop the wales using brass screws and finish washers, looks attractive enough to my eye, especially after the brass develops some patina.

Canoe stems seem as prone to dampness, dirt and bacterial rot as the butt ends of the thwarts or yoke, even with a drain hole at the deck plate tip. If I need to inspect, treat or repair anything up there I can zip out a few brass screws and the deck cap is off. I can then easily get to the inwale & outwale stems, and deck cap is easy to repair and retreat as a detached bench top project.

Aside from a slightly more elegant look I do not see the advantages of making an inset deck plate.

*Simply. OK, I will admit that an inset deck plate can be more elegant, especially with skilled craftsfolk laminating different woods for contrast.

Yeah, nope. I got no exotic woods, nor the skills to pull off an inset deck plate.

To the original question, I see no reason that Dynel, peel ply and epoxied wood deck plate tips would not help further protect wood stems.

Plain milky-opaque Dynel would not be that attractive. Maybe tape off deck tip triangles <I or diamonds <> at each tip, with graphite powder and a dab of black pigment in the epoxy mix to deeply saturate the Dynel.
 
Thanks for the feedback.

Ultimately I'm not sure that I want to be a wood gunwale canoe owner. I don't mind doing the work now, but I'm horrible at fall maintenance (loosening screws, inspecting and touching up wood finishes). Starting in September I have hunting seasons that take me into winter, and I can barely get the hoses put away before xmas.

I do like the approach of slightly oversizing the deck plates . I can't think of a downside to doing so. I hadn't considered all the other banging you mentioned. The downhill portage scrapes always make me cringe. I'm definitely not going to be attempting any inset plates. The originals weren't inset, and while I agree they can be attractive, I'm not interested in going there.

I'm a ways away from this particular step (dynel application), but will likely do as you suggest with graphite or pigment. Maybe red to match the hull... I did some dynel skid plates, but didn't have a 90 degree angle like I'll have going from the top of the board to the edge of the board. Any particular concerns or tips? At least I can do that application while the plates are still off the hull.
 
Ultimately I'm not sure that I want to be a wood gunwale canoe owner. I don't mind doing the work now, but I'm horrible at fall maintenance (loosening screws, inspecting and touching up wood finishes). Starting in September I have hunting seasons that take me into winter, and I can barely get the hoses put away before xmas.

Yup, right there with you. I lack enough inside storage for wood gunwale canoes, and would rather work on something new than do maintenance on something old.

My solution on most rebuilds has been to buy aluminum-insert vinyl gunwales. I have ordered them, sent my way waiting for a trailer-load of canoes to arrive at an outfitter. I have bought them from distant manufacturers on road trips and strapped them inside roof racked canoes (not recommended).

Mostly I am blessed with an outfitter (BMO) that keeps replacement vinyl gunwale in stock.

I will never re-gunwale another canoe in wood. Or worse, for installation battles, in aluminum.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMtLdE5Zq-8
 
I removed the plastic gunwales from my small canoe and replaced them with treated lumber from one of the box stores. I don't care for plastic. The treated lumber is yellow pine, clean with no knots, and was, shall I say, supple enough to take the bow and dip of the gunwale. I gave it a good rubbing of danish oil after it was cured out. I'm rough on my canoes in this area. Always banging into rocks and scooting over shallow shoals. Anything to do to catch fish and have a good time. But I keep my canoes hanging up when not in use. One in the basement, and the other one hanging in the carport above the old oil burning, gas guzzling, bass boat.

I'm waiting to see if we are going to get a picture of the finished canoe that dougd is working on.

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The treated lumber is yellow pine, clean with no knots, and was, shall I say, supple enough to take the bow and dip of the gunwale. I gave it a good rubbing of danish oil after it was cured out.

Thanks for the extra confirmation. I'm hoping to get the boards ripped tonight.
 
I finished rounding the gunwales over yesterday evening with the Radius Plane. Not a round as a router but I like the results and since I work mostly alone this is a good solution for me. A bit of sanding to still do before I stain them which brings me to my next quandry, the color of the original stain used. I tried Provincal which is kind of greyish and the Red Oak which is close but a tad to dark for my eyes. I saw a YouTube on mixing stains so may give that a shot. Then it's a dry fit and drilling holes on the inwales before several coats of varnish. Slow but sure!
 
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