boat advice: solo canoe for 1-2 week river trips?

[Magnus919]

No Title

It was cool and rained a bit off and on most of the morning, but I did get out on Beaverdam Lake in Raleigh with it. Yeah, temporary boat for sure. Though the seat is super comfy. Still, it's a bit wide, a lot heavy, and pretty slow even for a canoe.

 

[sweeper]

I think I've heard that line before

Me too, I'm in with or, as usual this year, without him. That's the beauty of solo boats and having the right gear.

 

[BWCA66]

The WPASCA looks like it's about a 10 hr drive, might need to make that work.

 

[Nodrama43]

Looking at WPASCR site and wondering if members here camp in tents or rv's? Am assuming the campground fills up so it is best to get tickets as soon as they become available? It is about a 4 1/2 hour drive for m so I am definitely going to attend and bring a couple of canoes.

 

[Magnus919]

Looking at WPASCR site and wondering if members here camp in tents or rv's? Am assuming the campground fills up so it is best to get tickets as soon as they become available? It is about a 4 1/2 hour drive for m so I am definitely going to attend and bring a couple of canoes.

My plan is to bring a tent. It'll probably take me 9+ hours to get up there.

 

[Guest]

Yeah, temporary boat for sure. Though the seat is super comfy. Still, it's a bit wide, a lot heavy, and pretty slow

I just read the OT catalog spec for the Next. 59 lbs? Hopefully that weight includes the seat/back and foot braces.

That is heavy for a 13 foot canoe. The RX Old Town Pack was “listed”* at 33lbs, and 59lbs is the same “listed” weight as your 16 foot Camper.

“Listed”. Out of curiosity have your weighed the Next? Old Town was sometimes a bit, um, understated with their given weights.

*OK, this canoe was an anomaly, but a friend had the world’s heaviest OT Pack. It was built in 1991 when there were some screwy things going on with a change in RX sheet production. He was a big guy, too big for the boat actually, and when the thwart rotted out he paddled it unthwarted. The hull should have folded around him like a bean pod, but all it did was flex inwards a bit at the seat.

When I installed a new thwart for him I discovered that his Pack was absurdly heavy; it was easily 45lbs, maybe more. Of course that Uber Pack is still going strong 25 abusive years later.

Perhaps the Next is an “occasional use” canoe rather than temporary. There is a place, or places, for a 13 foot canoe, even a heavy one, where speed matters less; twisty go-slow marsh gut penetrations or thick swamp stream explores. Small boat, small places.

And the Next is poly, so when you drop composite coin on a Keewaydin 15 or Shearwater you’ll still have a canoe to beat up for years to come on shallow rocky river day trips.

That does beg the question “How many canoes does a man need?”

Other than the answer “Just one more” I would defend: a lightweight composite tripper (your next canoe), an RX or expedition layup tripper, a shorter hull for twisty and occluded stuff, a whitewater or poling boat if such suits your pursuits. Maybe a decked sailing canoe with rudder. At least 4 purpose designed canoes, maybe 5.

I like the skewed perspective of panoramic shot with the double blade wings. What length double did you use?

BTW – I refuse to type Next all in caps. That is some OT ad-man’s idea.

 

[yellowcanoe]

NEXT would be an ideal craft for the Buffalo or Current.. gravel bar floating. but it won't be your LAST

Looking at WPASCR site and wondering if members here camp in tents or rv's? Am assuming the campground fills up so it is best to get tickets as soon as they become available? It is about a 4 1/2 hour drive for m so I am definitely going to attend and bring a couple of canoes.

It probably fills up with the Midieval event in August that draws 20,000 maidens and knights and armoured horses etc
but there is no need and no way to reserve sites for WPASCR.. the campground is 450 acrres of fields and treed areas. You can camp in a tent or an RV.. since we hang out in Willow or Gander Landing or Secluded Glen we have no hookups.

This is an event you just can come to so lets not try to complicate things. There are probably 200 people or so there for the weekend.. giving each of you 2 acres.

https://www.cooperslake.com/home/index.php

 

[BWCA66]

NEXT would be an ideal craft for the Buffalo or Current.. gravel bar floating. but it won't be your LAST


It probably fills up with the Midieval event in August that draws 20,000 maidens and knights and armoured horses etc
but there is no need and no way to reserve sites for WPASCR.. the campground is 450 acrres of fields and treed areas. You can camp in a tent or an RV.. since we hang out in Willow or Gander Landing or Secluded Glen we have no hookups.

This is an event you just can come to so lets not try to complicate things. There are probably 200 people or so there for the weekend.. giving each of you 2 acres.

https://www.cooperslake.com/home/index.php

Trees for hammocks?

 

[Magnus919]

No Title

Trees for hammocks?

 

[Magnus919]

The forum shrunk down my satellite image... but yes. The area around the pond has large clear areas as well as wooded areas.

 

[sweeper]

Looks open

http://wpascr.org/2016.htm

 

[Magnus919]

I just read the OT catalog spec for the Next. 59 lbs? Hopefully that weight includes the seat/back and foot braces.

It's unusually dense for its small stature, yes.

Out of curiosity have your weighed the Next? Old Town was sometimes a bit, um, understated with their given weights.

Not yet, but I intend to this week as I'll be writing something up about this boat for my blog (which probably won't be published until I get out with it some more). I'll share the weight here, though, as soon as I weigh it in.

When I installed a new thwart for him I discovered that his Pack was absurdly heavy; it was easily 45lbs, maybe more. Of course that Uber Pack is still going strong 25 abusive years later.

Old Town Pack? Sounds more like an Old Town Stacked. Beefcake!

Perhaps the Next is an “occasional use” canoe rather than temporary. There is a place, or places, for a 13 foot canoe, even a heavy one, where speed matters less; twisty go-slow marsh gut penetrations or thick swamp stream explores. Small boat, small places.

We definitely have places here where I'd rather have this than a $$$$ carbon infused basalt innegra boat. One of my favorite quiet little holes is Robertson Millpond Preserve which is an artificial pond with an ecosystem more like a black cypress swamp, minus the alligators. It's a great little place for spending 2 hours on the water. But you're not getting out without some scrapes from submerged cypress roots. Also, in some sections, inches of draft count.

That does beg the question “How many canoes does a man need?”

I'll let you know when I get there.

Other than the answer “Just one more” I would defend: a lightweight composite tripper (your next canoe)

Yup. I almost have to name the next boat "Nexit".

My wife is starting to get jealous of my stories of seeing bald eagles, ducks engaged in mating dances, beaver dams, and other things she only ever sees on TV. So aside from all of the solo boats this man needs, I suspect more tandem boats will be needed, too. Or more solo boats, if m'lady would prefer. Though the few times we've been out together, she seems to prefer riding in the bow seat and letting me do all of the paddling. Given what she adds to the scenery, I don't mind one bit.

Then there are the three children...

I like the skewed perspective of panoramic shot with the double blade wings. What length double did you use?

The panorama shots were suffering a bit of an optical illusion, as you might imagine. I need to be mindful of that in the future. The paddle is an Adventure Technology Odyssey 230, extended to 250, at a 45 degree feather. This boat feels like it needs something longer.

 

[Guest]

Also, in some sections, inches of draft count.

Your Camper, with its flat bottom and broad beam, makes a good shallow draft day boat. At this point, with the future of T-formex unknown, I’d be loath to part with any decent Royalex canoe.

The paddle is an Adventure Technology Odyssey 230, extended to 250, at a 45 degree feather. This boat feels like it needs something longer.

250cm seems long enough for the Next, and above 250 the choices in double blades become far more limited.

My wife is starting to get jealous of my stories of seeing bald eagles, ducks engaged in mating dances, beaver dams, and other things she only ever sees on TV. So aside from all of the solo boats this man needs, I suspect more tandem boats will be needed, too. Or more solo boats, if m'lady would prefer. Though the few times we've been out together, she seems to prefer riding in the bow seat and letting me do all of the paddling. Given what she adds to the scenery, I don't mind one bit.

You never know what someone will prefer in a paddlecraft. If the missus is/becomes principally a warm weather paddlers she might prefer a (fast, non-beanpod) sit-on-top to a solo canoe. And in any solo boat you could get a look at her from the side or front as well as staring at her back all day.

I don’t know her size/weight (not asking), but of all our solo canoes my wife most likes the Vermont-era Mad River Independence (15 foot 8 inch x 29 inch). Plus I couldn’t beat the price; FREE, with rotted gunwales and thwarts. I put the novice anxious wife of a friend in our Independence. She went from a non-paddler to a paddler in one afternoon, and hubby soon found a used Indy.

For smaller statured folk the Vermont era MRC Liberty was a fine canoe, 14 foot 8 inches x 28 ¾ inches, and available in purple. Or the MRC Slipper (14 foot 7 inches x 27 ½ inches. Yeah, I am partial to Vermont-era MRC’s.

I don’t want to be misogynistic, but a lot of the women I know prefer a faster, sleeker hull. Or ageist; that same less-paddling-effort goes for kid boats. My sons, even when they were pre-teens, could easily keep pace in their little solos (OT Rushton, Dagger Tupelo, Wilderness Piccolo kayak), and now have to slow their roll for dad.

My wife in her chosen boats is usually ahead of me as well. dang, I know I’m no longer the strongest paddler in the family, but I hope I’m not now fourth best.

Just trying to add to your Keep a Craigslist Eye Out index and help lighten your wallet.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

I know where there's a nice MR Liberty that one might convince the owner to sell (a bit too small for me). Might even be able to arrange delivery for some distance, if I can make the return trip with an Indy on the roof.

 

[Magnus919]

Your Camper, with its flat bottom and broad beam, makes a good shallow draft day boat. At this point, with the future of T-formex unknown, I’d be loath to part with any decent Royalex canoe.

Indeed. I've been really itchy to get it down to NC from my parents' garage in PA. My parents are in that age of early retirement where they spend a little time at home and a lot of time on the road in their RV. The soonest I can get my hands on it is May 2017. I really feel like if I can get my kids back into the Millpond, and they can feel the magic there that I feel, at least one of them is going to get bitten by the paddle bug.

250cm seems long enough for the Next, and above 250 the choices in double blades become far more limited.

Yeah. I probably just need to play with it more and find the right form that's comfortable with this boat. One thing's for sure, though: paddling this boat with a single blade seems like it would be an awkward affair.

I don’t know her size/weight (not asking),

Tallllll and skinny. A long time ago she was a high fashion runway model. She's about 5'11". Really into yoga.

Actually she might enjoy SUP... especially given how many yogis love to practice on top of a SUP.

I'm 6'1" (down an inch from my youth), she's 5'11"... so as you might imagine, our three kids are all taller-than-average for their age groups.

Just trying to add to your Keep a Craigslist Eye Out index and help lighten your wallet.

Hahaha yep... good points all around. My main objectives for them right now are more around just getting them on the water, getting them bit by the bug. I'm going to be a little selfish and say the next purchase is for my composite solo boat. Though if something happened between now and my commissioning of that boat, I'd be happy to save a little longer and get a composite tandem boat. Or "suffer" the Next longer to get my bride her own composite solo boat. Or anything that would make my family want to spend more time on the water with me. Though, I hope it doesn't sound selfish of me to say this, I also very much look forward to solitary paddling. I'm with Rilke on this:

A good marriage is that in which each appoints the other guardian of [their] solitude.

 

[Guest]

I know where there's a nice MR Liberty that one might convince the owner to sell (a bit too small for me). Might even be able to arrange delivery for some distance, if I can make the return trip with an Indy on the roof.

There are more than a few 80’s/90’s canoes I would jump for at a reasonable used price. Our Indy is a Waitsfield glass layup, probably close to 50 lbs with new oversize ash gunwales and a sailing thwart, but even at my weight it is a comfortable day paddling canoe (I dropped the new contour seat an inch +)

Same for a Vermont day’s kevlar Explorer or Malecite.

My penchant for Vermont era composite canoes is partly based on their used availability in the mid-Atlantic region, and partly because the Waitsfield craftsmanship was usually tough and top notch

 

[yellowcanoe]

That Camper is a heck of a poling boat.
Why sell it? Buy a pole! Make a pole!

 

[Magnus919]

That Camper is a heck of a poling boat.
Why sell it? Buy a pole! Make a pole!

No way, not selling it.

 

[Guest]

Um, well, jeeze, ya know, if you bring her along on a test paddle trip I will make every effort to be there. heck, I’ll bring a couple slender solo boats for her to try.

Though, I hope it doesn't sound selfish of me to say this, I also very much look forward to solitary paddling.

From a guy who needs his alone time, even on family or group trips, that doesn’t sound selfish as all. But, as guardian of their own solitude, and captain of their own ship, one of our happiest family paddling days was when the boys went into their own solo boats, as then did the missus and I.

I rarely miss having a bowman, and I relish being able to actually see my family paddling beside (or in front of me), and not just see their back, repeatedly asking “What?” when they mumble something up in the bow.

“Mumble”, “What?”, “MUMBLE”, “WHAT?”, “Never mind”

Rafting up together in an eddy, letting/having them take the front as first to see the moose or otter, bear, beaver or ducklings, watching their lines and strokes, seeing them develop a feel for leading and picking route choices; I wouldn’t trade that for all the tandems in the world.

It somehow feels more like they are out there with me when they are in their own boats.