What will be the effect of electric vehicles on canoe tripping?

[CaptainOllieWest]

When I go on trips it usually involves going over mountain passes and staying in remote areas. Often, I pull a 5th wheel trailer. For these reasons an EV is only a distant thought for replacing my diesel 1999 F350. I will keep my old truck alive for now. She will likely go over 300K this summer. Now if they would build a diesel electric hybrid pickup ...



For my family, a pure EV wouldn't be ideal as a family car as we regularly travel over mountain passes to visit relatives and access our vacation property. Some high end EVs have the potential range, but adding mountain passes and cold weather in the winter would be nerve racking.

 

[yknpdlr]

Without getting political (yet), the government has the means and will make the choice easy for us all. We will all be priced out of being able to afford even a single gallon of gasoline or diesel.

Solar trickle chargers left on an unatttended vehicle will be the next theft target as catalytic converters are now.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

All the dollars she saved on gas over the years were needed to pay for the necessary battery upgrade.

No gasoline to pay for but electricity costs money. I suppose one could figure out from their electric bills how much charging at home costs, but I have no idea how much money (or time) it costs to charge at a charging station. Does anyone?

 

[billconner]

I've read the gotcha if PHEVs is that published mileage assumes you do plug it in, but most people don't, so get lower mileage.

 

[CaptainOllieWest]

Here is an invoice for a model 3 battery replacement.

I envision a lot of EVs being recycled instead of being maintained and driven more than 10ish years. I am not sure how this plays into their overall environmental impact.

 

[scoutergriz]

Just one of my concerns is that here in northern NY were I frequently see winter temperatures of -20F or even approaching -40 on some mornings. How well will a battery vehicle tolerate those temps, and how cold will I have to keep the cabin versus gettting a few more miles out of the battery?

Apart from winter concerns, my canoe race team and I traveled to the Yukon River races (five times so far), some 3,000 miles up and back again. It can be done in 4-5 days (or less) with drivers taking turns at the wheel and frequent stops at gas stations. Until EV charging stations become as common on every road as gasoline pumps are now, how long will I have to wait in line to get my turn at a charger? What happens when I run out of charge on the road? I see vehicles with extra gas cans strapped on their vehicle now, but I doubt they will be able to carry and switch to extra battery packs. It is not as easy as hitching a ride to the nearest filling station and gabbing a plastic portable can of gas to carry back to my car so I can drive a few miles to the station. If I have limited daily range, how much more will it cost me in hotel rooms for the extra travel days?

I really cannot imagine farmers, much less heavy equipment operators and highway maintenance equipment managers, ditching their heavy gas/diesel tractors, excavators and bull dozers and buying them all new as EV.

actually many farmers are already switching their tractors to autonomous electric ones that can run all day on a single charge and don't require a driver.
Here's one from John Deere-

 

[yknpdlr]

actually many farmers are already switching their tractors to autonomous electric ones that can run all day on a single charge and don't require a driver.

At what cost? Are large and small time rural family farms expected to afford such an equipment switch to in short order replace their current existing fleet of gas/diesel driven equipment that would presumably have zero trade-in value except as scrap metal?

 

[billconner]

I thought the goal was by 2050, so not really in short order. Certainly not expected to be as fast a the aluminum to composite transition was. Hopefully faster than the imperial to metric change. Oh yeah, homebuilder lobbying still has that stalled since the 1960s.

 

[Keeled Over]

If (when) we go all electric I wonder what will happen to my kids rent for their apartments. Putting in the system to charge a couple of hundred cars at nite won't be cheap.

 

[madmike]

I have an electric car. Have no fear. My transportation is easy and cheap.

 

[Gamma1214]

As long as I can find parts for my '94 an EV is unlikely to be part of my future. My transport is easy & cheap as well (and the vast majority if the vehicle's carbon footprint as 30 years ago).

I have thought about converting it to CNG (pretty easily done) when/if filling stations become more prevalent and I'm currently working on adding a hydrogen generator to boost fuel economy. I have no plans to fill the bed with batteries & add an onboard charger.

 

[Ralph]

In many places in Canada (and in much of canoe country in the US) there are a number of issues that limit the use of electric vehicles - long distances to travel, low population density, cold. As some have noted above, the time it takes to recharge an electric vehicle which would mean a much longer time to complete a trip to a canoeing destination and back with the resultant increase in costs for time off work, for shelter and for food.
I often go paddling on the backroads of western Alberta or northern Saskatchewan where there are no gas stations for hundreds of kilometers because there are not enough people to support more gas stations. It's relatively easy to carry an extra 20 liters of fuel - not so with an electric vehicle. There currently are very few recharging stations and, as far as I know, no easy way to carry a recharge.
It will be quite a while before electric vehicles become common outside our larger communities.

 

[yknpdlr]

In many places in Canada (and in much of canoe country in the US) there are a number of issues that limit the use of electric vehicles - long distances to travel, low population density, cold. As some have noted above, the time it takes to recharge an electric vehicle which would mean a much longer time to complete a trip to a canoeing destination and back with the resultant increase in costs for time off work, for shelter and for food.
I often go paddling on the backroads of western Alberta or northern Saskatchewan where there are no gas stations for hundreds of kilometers because there are not enough people to support more gas stations. It's relatively easy to carry an extra 20 liters of fuel - not so with an electric vehicle. There currently are very few recharging stations and, as far as I know, no easy way to carry a recharge.
It will be quite a while before electric vehicles become common outside our larger communities.

So, as I had suspected, if I were constrained to own an EV now as my only transport vehicle at my home in NY state, there is no practical nor any reasonable way at any price for me to transport myself along with my canoe to Whitehorse and return from the Yukon River races as I have done five times in the past decade. Clearly that most likely will be the case for an unknown many years to come until multiple charging stations magically emerge every 200 miles or less.

 

[stripperguy]

Hydrogen powered fuel cells have been in use since the Apollo missions.
Fuel cell powered forklifts have dominated over fossil fuel and battery electrics for a few years now.
The future of EV’s is likely not limited by battery capacity or charging stations.
I recently bid some work for fuel cell powered commercial passenger aircraft
So don’t constrain your imagination to just batteries…
The future EV’s just might be powered by hydrogen, clean, sustainable and eventually not cost prohibitive.

 

[billconner]

There were no charging stations in 2010 and over 55,000 now, with 200,000 expected by 2030. Very likely there will be enough to get to the Yukon by 2050, plus doubling or more the range of a charge and halving or less the time to charge.

Here's a map of Walmarts. Everyone will have a charging station before long. (2030 according to Walmart) In the mean time, be content to keep polluting. For some it also means higher water levels from the resultant climate change, which can be good for some paddlers

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I think this topic has run its course. Thanks to all for contributing. Locked.