Too Cool for School? (No paddling on school trip)

[MrPoling]

This week I chaperoned a school trip to a nearby 4H camp. The trip was 2 nights. The camp, staff, teacher chaperones, and parent chaperones were awesome. The kids had a great time being outside and away from screens. They even got to do a 25 ft high ropes course.

But the canoes went unused.



The good news is there was lots of evidence of canoeing. There were dozens canoes*. But we didn't get to canoe. I was pleased to hear a few kids who wanted to go canoeing.

I discussed it with the camp staff and the teachers. The barriers to paddling were camp staff and the school district.

The staffing obstacle isn't impossible. This camp uses canoes all the time, they just have to have the right staff scheduled. Those canoes get lots of use (abuse!) from the kids during the normal summer camps.

But the impossible obstacle was the school district. Our school district is one of many, including one of the largest in the state, that will not allow water sports. I was told the school district's insurance policy won't allow it.

My hunch is this comes down to cost and complexity. Maybe a policy that allowed water sports would cost more? Maybe it would involve lots of extra rules around water sport activities and effort from school staff to document compliance. I suppose it could be political too, meaning that school board members fear having to answer for tragic events.

Normally money is the best explanation, and its disheartening. The high school has bathrooms that don't work, so they should probably fix that before they get a more expensive insurance policy.

Still I'm sad about it. I think the kids are better off having instruction in water sport fun and safety.


* Boat report:
The fleet included a few dozen aluminum canoes, some had their thier ends patched twice. There were at least a dozen Discoveries, some sporting their second set of Kevlar skid plates. I was pleased to see a trailer full of Royalex canoes for white water use in the mild rivers nearby. There were even two solo white water canoes. Finally, there was a workshop where canoes were getting the TLC required for constant use.
But not a kayak in sight!

 

[yellowcanoe]

Memaquay? You were involved heavily in school outings? Any words of help?

 

[recped]

Almost certainly it's the cost of liability insurance that would cover on water situations is extremely high.

In a vaguely similar situation, I own a property where the Bruce Trail (Canadian equivalent of the AT) passes through, I can do maintenance of the section of trail on my property but I I want to join a work party (chainsaw in hand) to do maintenance on the trail that is not on my property I MUST use full body armour (kevlar chaps, special gloves, full helmet and face guard etc) or it's not permitted. Even at that a licensed arbourist must be in the group or the use of chainsaws is forbidden.

This is all about restrictions by insurance companies in spite of the relatively high premiums that are already in effect.

 

[MrPoling]

"Drowning is a leading cause of death for children."

I get this, it only takes seconds for something horrible to happen. I would not want to chaperone those kids in canoes without lots of qualified help. I think the school group is especially problematic because it includes lots of kids who lack swimming skills, enthusiasm, or judgment. All of those things can be bad if combined with peer pressure.

They did a great job with the ropes course, and I could see it was very unlikely for there to be a death or crippling injury there. It's straight forward to control 10 kids around a rope course obstacle. But five canoes on the lake could be a problem.

 

[JohnSand]

I understand. My friend operates a non-profit sailing organization. He recruited me to help cruise with Naval Sea Cadets. I wasn't very enthusiastic, I raised teenagers. But my interaction with these young people was very rewarding. The Sea Cadets have their own insurance, perhaps 4H does too.

 

[yknpdlr]

I am certain that liability issues and insurance is the reason.
For 30 years I was involved in a training program for wilderness trek guides (mainly those of college age) who would be employed at BSA resident summer camps in the Adirondacks. For canoe trips, BSA policy originally required all participants (scouts and adult leaders) to pass a swimmer's test to go on canoe trips. A quirk in state health department law says that if the trip originates from a resident BSA camp, then a certified lifeguard (Red Cross trained or equivalent) must also be with them on the trip. But if a troop wanted to take a canoe trip on their own, without departing from a resident camp, that state rule did ot apply. Eventually the BSA policy was changed to require a currently certified lifeguard on all paddle trips, regardless if it was a weekend wilderness local troop planned trip, or a week-long departure from a resident camp even simple day trips). Turns out that few troops have regular access to a certified lifeguard (which I was), and too many were going out on their own anyway without. So BSA then revised the policy again to require all participants pass a specific "swimmers" skill test (or be a First Class Scout and have earned a swimming merit badge) as sufficient for local troop trips not from a resident camp. If any scout (or adult leader, some of which could not pass) failed the test they could still go only if a certified lifeguard was paddling in the same boat. All trip requests with details must be approved by the local council.

I also volunteer to do trail work and leanto shelter building in the Adirondacks. First of all, motorized tools, including all motor vehicles and chainsaws are not allowed in wilderness areas. We are allowed chainsaws at certain specific off-season times of the year only. Otherwise we may use a small battery powered saw for leanto construction and trim with the previously prepared logs brought in. To operate a chainsaw, we are required to wear all the mandated protective gear, and to be certified with a state approved training class, which includes a segment on blood-borne pathogens.

 

[billconner]

Difficult to quite comprehend for someone who rode bikes as a kid and never imagined wearing a helmut.

 

[memaquay]

Our school club ran for over 50 years before covid shut it down. We are in the process of trying to get it going again, but the regulations are fairly onerous. We have qualified staff, one has his wilderness canoe tripping cert, as do I, and several have their wilderness first aid certs. Most are quite experienced as well. The thing that is holding us up is the need to have a fully qualified lifeguard on the trip. Certification and re-certifications for lifeguards has been shut down for over three years, it is proving to be very difficult.

A well run canoe trip with experienced leaders has been shown to have far less risk that regular high school sports. The worst injury on a week long trip is usually blisters and sun burn.

Many schools have been hiring professional guides to run their programs. It is costly, but liability is transferred to the group running the show. We discussed this, but we have over 50 years of tradition and certain ways of doing things that we don't want to lose, so we will have to try to fix this lifeguard problem.

 

[MrPoling]

BSA then revised the policy again to require all participants pass a specific "swimmers" skill test (or be a First Class Scout and have earned a swimming merit badge) as sufficient for local troop trips not from a resident camp. If any scout (or adult leader, some of which could not pass) failed the test they could still go only if a certified lifeguard was paddling in the same boat. All trip requests with details must be approved by the local council. Kim

This sounds pretty reasonable to me, at least for class 1-2 stuff suitable for a scout trip.

Also the part about the parents not being able to pass the test. An unprepared or arrogant parent is worse than 3 difficult kids. The ropes course is good because the out of shape parents know not to try it. But I suspect many of those same parents would have flopped into canoes. Nothing ruins a trip like somebody's Mom swimming to shore then having a heart attack.

 

[jdeerfoot]

I volunteer with the local nature center which is operated by a non-profit which leases the property from the county which owns it. The center has liability insurance which covers all activities including canoe and kayak rentals to the general public as well as canoeing and kayaking on the river during annual summer day camp for kids. The boat rentals are a significant source of income - generally about $25-30,000 annually and during the pandemic one year’s income was $50,000. I have no idea what the liability insurance costs but I have never heard the director or board members complain about it.

 

[Frenchy19]

Totally a liability issue. I taught for nearly 30 years, and the litigious growth of US culture over that time span had an incredible impact on what we were allowed to do with students when on field trips. Over the course of my teaching career, I took groups of students on winter BWCA camping/dogsledding trips, summer BWCA paddling trips, paddling trips on area rivers and lakes led by Wilderness Inquiry, week-long archaeological experiences in AZ, CO and IL and numerous biking adventures. As the years moved forward, those trips were axed by admin due to fear of lawsuits.

I got out of the classroom a little over a year ago, and a buddy of mine whom I taught with for 10 years said he cannot get admin to allow him to take small groups of students on a 10 minute walk to a local park due to liability concerns. Really quite sad/pathetic.

 

[scoutergriz]

Yup, liability.... I was a paddling and outdoor skills instructor for over 20 years working with youth, Had a Scouts Canada water charge, CRCA (now Paddle Canada), Cert, and DND approval for working with cadets. Over the last 5-6 years that has all changed- Scouts, school , and church groups all decided I needed a certified lifeguard and $5 million public liability, and DND gentrified their cadet programs. I never charged for my services and only occasionally received and honorarium for my services, now those same groups wanted me to pay $1200/ year of my own money to cover their butts.
I shut down and sold my trainer boats....

 

[yknpdlr]

wearing

Difficult to quite comprehend for someone who rode bikes as a kid and never imagined wearing a helmut.

Or seat belts in a car, even while riding behind the back seat of a station wagon.