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Tie-downs for Transport

No doubt in my mind.. I know that my truck and those of my friend flex and twist cab and body independently on logging roads in my area. Your canoeing area may differ. Sometimes we have had to have a group of rock movers to fill in deep holes in the road, especially if the logging road is not currently being logged and maintained. I have not fond memories of the Oxbow Road in NE Maine where you swore the truck would twist in two.

I think that its kind of useless to depend on others opinions but the opinions are useful in what you should watch for in your own situation. The same for the hmmmm reported of straps. It has happened to me seldom but now I know some tricks if it does happen in the future.

Its not wrong or right. Its what works for you.
 
Oupss, I didn't want to start a non ending debate... One thing for sure is that up here we have some pretty rough roads... Actually, what they call the Highway can be quite, how can I say, bumpy... Not much for logging road lol, but mining rd that are from the 60's and where the only way in or out is on 4 low and with chains.... But that is of an other subject...

Not many people paddle super light craft up here, other than the one that paddle the Yukon River Quest... And they don't leave the paved rd.
 
So I got a set of towers for the cab, for this year.

I haven't used them yet though - why do people say they are not a good idea? Hard to fasten to the truck?

Depending on the towers they are not hard to fasten if they are properly positioned and installed. I’m not a fan of towers that hook over the door edge. There’s nothing wrong with them functionally, I just don’t much care for even a padded tower clamped to the metal roof or, on some vehicles, compressing the window gasket.

On the whole I’d rather use crossbars on the truck cap, or on naked bedrails a construction-style rack. Depending on the truck there isn’t a lot of spacing between a pair of crossbars on the cab roof. Three feet of rack spacing leaves a lot of unsupported canoe, which is a lot of potential wiggle stress both on the hull and on the tower connections.

But as an occasional option I have been meaning to add a single bar to the cab roof of the Tacoma to augment the racks on the cap. The crossbars on the cap are only four feet apart, so with 17 foot canoe centered on the bars there is 6 ½ feet of unsupported bow cantilevered out front. Even with well tied boats when I rack a light composite tandem the bow shows noticeable wiggle and flex in windy conditions.

The Taco is a xtra-cab, so there is a good 5 feet of space between the front cap crossbar and where a front cab crossbar would fit. Using the front cab bar from a Thule 480 foot pack would give me the option to clamp a crossbar on the cab roof and give me three crossbars spaced out over nine feet of roofline.



And I could shift the canoes forward a bit, so I would have less overhang in the back.



That third crossbar would not be something I need or even want on every trip, for short drives near to home or carrying a couple of smaller solo canoes no need, but for carrying two 17 foot boats crosscountry it couldn’t hurt, especially through windstorms on the plains.

And, in a short shuttle pinch, I could probably get a third canoe up the middle, resting on the cab roof crossbar and the front cap crossbar, nestled between two canoe spaced outboard on the 78 inch cap bars.

There has been a long-standing debate on whether the flexural and torsional moments between the pickup's cab and box are significant enough to impact the structure and/or the security of the tie-down on the canoe.

The movement between cab and box on a pickup seems to have been more significant on older models, but I have no data comparing then and now.

If you had stiff mounts on both cab and box-- and were concerned with movement-- you might consider foam mounts similar to the ones I posted earlier, to buffer between the gunwales and the cross-bar.

I tend to think that any movement between the cab and bed on modern trucks is minimal, at least in normal non-rockhopping types of travel. Looking at the proximity of the cab and bed on the Taco there is less than a pinkie width gap in places. That is not a lot of wiggle room before I’d have the cab grinding against the bed.

It would be a moot point in any case. The cap on the Taco is a mid-rise; it is 3 inches taller than the cab roof, purposefully chosen so that the recurved bow of a canoe clears the cab roof. I would need to build up the cab crossbar height under the gunwales with minicel. Might be a good use for the inexpensive minicel yoga blocks.
 
That third crossbar would not be something I need or even want on every trip, for short drives near to home or carrying a couple of smaller solo canoes no need, but for carrying two 17 foot boats crosscountry it couldn’t hurt, especially through windstorms on the plains.

I had some real frankenstein racks on my old Grand Caravan that gave me something like 10' of bar spread. They used the clamped on Thule racks for a base and extended out from there. As a result I had 4 cross braces. Having a center brace (or two) does help to cinch down a load securely but mostly it's just a pain in the arse because every boat you haul will need to be handled differently. The more rise there is to the shear the higher the gunwales will be above the center rails. And if you ever try to carry a kayak right side up, especially if it has any rocker, it will want to contact the center bar(s) first. All this leaves you carrying around multiple thicknesses of foam trying to find the right combination to take up the empty space but not put undue stress on the hull.

Of course if you're only carrying canoes upside down then you can just let the gunwales float over that center bar without strapping them down to it unless you think you need the extra security; then you can start playing the 'fit the foam' game. I didn't have that option since my far forward and rear cross bars weren't strong enough to support the canoe by themselves, rather they just kept the bow/stern from being blown to the side. So for anything more than a quick one mile drive to the local river it was a bit of an ordeal.

Alan
 
Third crossbars can be handy.. I am doing that now.. twist or no twist. Specifically to haul an extra boat so that I can have two of my own( one for me and one for hubby) and have room to transport a boat for someone else from somewhere on our route to somewhere else.. For gas money.

The Truck Twist Dance really is not a factor on the interstates.

The Plains have their own devil wind monster. Three might be good. We had just two when a tower broke

So I now have a spare Yakima !A tower for me and two more if anyone else needs.
 
I had some real frankenstein racks on my old Grand Caravan that gave me something like 10' of bar spread. As a result I had 4 cross braces.

We had the last model year the Plymouth Voyager sported rain gutters. Great boat toter with multiple crossbars. Horrible Chrysler transmission(s).

Same as on our E-150. Four sets of Quick and Easy crossbars spaced out along 11 feet of roofline. That will accommodate 4 canoes, all resting gunwales flat, staggered one forward, one back, one forward, one back.

Hull 1 and 3 load from the front, with the gunwales resting on crossbars 1 and 3, canoes 2 and 4 load from the back and rest on crossbars 2 and 4. Nice load spacing, so no crossbar is holding more than two canoes.

Fitting the gunwale stops was tricky, since I wanted to be able to slide the canoes onto the very high racks from either end. I put wood block gunwale stops on the middle bars to trap one stem between the outwales. Once the bow slides into that /____\ trap I know the boat is properly positioned on the racks.

I didn’t want wood blocks spaced out along the length of the front and rear crossbars occluding my slide on loading action, so I paired the wood gunwale blocks to trap just the outboard edge of the gunwales. Hard to describe, picture wood gunwale blocks set just a gunwale width apart on each crossbar edge \\--------------//. Once I slide the bow into that V trap I just lift the stern and set it between the outboard gunwale stops.



Having a center brace (or two) does help to cinch down a load securely but mostly it's just a pain in the arse because every boat you haul will need to be handled differently. The more rise there is to the shear the higher the gunwales will be above the center rails.

With any of our canoe choice configurations I just tie off the belly lines to the respective gunwale contact crossbars. I sometimes throw a mid-roof belly line over all four, but it really isn’t doing much, since none of the gunwale actually contact the midships crossbars.

And if you ever try to carry a kayak right side up, especially if it has any rocker, it will want to contact the center bar(s) first. All this leaves you carrying around multiple thicknesses of foam trying to find the right combination to take up the empty space but not put undue stress on the hull.

Of course if you're only carrying canoes upside down then you can just let the gunwales float over that center bar without strapping them down to it unless you think you need the extra security; then you can start playing the 'fit the foam' game. I didn't have that option since my far forward and rear cross bars weren't strong enough to support the canoe by themselves, rather they just kept the bow/stern from being blown to the side. So for anything more than a quick one mile drive to the local river it was a bit of an ordeal.

The four boat van rack is a bit of a loading ordeal.

There are eye bolts through those wood gunwale blocks so that the belly lines wrap tight to the hull edges. Lots of eye bolts. 16 (I just counted). That does require a very specific canoe loading and belly line tie off order. I can’t get to the middle eye bolts after the outboard positioned canoes are in place, so there is a here is round and round the van alternating side pattern for running the belly lines.

16 eye bolts, four different belly lines. I started carrying two step ladders, so I didn’t have to remember to carry one from alternating side to side as I danced around the van.

It is also a little specific as to which family canoes choices best fit in which slot without rubbing against each other. I have a stack of index card sketches to remind me which canoes best fit where.

I do have a couple sets of custom carved minicel cradles to hold the far ends for a couple of the decked boat better against a third crossbar, attached via a couple of webbing straps with the cradle position sharpie marked on the bar.
 
Mike, of course you're right.

While torque and flex between the cab and bed is a fact when driving on uneven surfaces, it isn't much. I used cab and bed mounts for years, and the canoes I carried still look the same.
 
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While torque and flex between the cab and bed is a fact when driving on uneven surfaces, it isn't much. I used cab and bed mounts for years, and the canoes I carried still look the same.

Peach, I would think a foam block would accommodate any minor flex from normal driving conditions.

I’d be more leery of canoes tied off straight onto crossbars on both the cab and the cap. A little concerned for the canoe but more for the crossbar tower to vehicle connection. That seems like an area where even a minor twist might have major consequences down the windy road.

I have not (knock wood) had any towers damaged in high winds, but we did have a gunwale bracket fail. It was admittedly blowing so hard we had difficulty opening the truck doors when we stopped.
 
I have transported one or two lightweight solos thousands of miles with my ranger with yakama bar in front and fastened to my cap in the rear over sometimes really rough roads. My 2%.
Turtle
 
When something works for them I really appreciate knowing the environment the activity is in.
Yah I think location matters.

Right now our home camp road needs a grader.. Its dirt and rough but not causing truck twist.
 
On a wooden pickup-truck rack, just 4 bungies (2 at each end). On my car rack, front painter to front bumper, tie down strap over middle, bungi cord at rear.
 
Well its frost heave season again..
And I immersed my boats and straps in 700 miles of brine filled driving. Cam straps are now in the spa soaking in warm water. Checked the springs.. they still work fine ( its a good idea that does not always get done around here to check yours annually at least)

Do they need a lubricant? Grease people which lubricant? Mind you I am touchy about grease. Our travel trailer wheel bearings caught fire.. And they had been serviced( supposedly by a professional shop) the week before we left home. There was almost no grease in them.. even the one that the outer cap stayed on.
 
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