Electrical Power in the Field

[southcove]

As long as your needs are only for the truck/base camping, any set up with a small size AGM (like Gdwelders) or lead acid battery (like a lawn tractor battery from Wal-mart) paired w a decent size fixed or folding solar panels - that should be plenty of juice for camp for almost any # of devices with the occasional charge up by truck or AC power at home. Anything 12v or USB powered should be more efficient in the process than charging batteries.

In the field, you can go with what others use, but if you are USB oriented for your devices and need a bit more light than a headlamp or Luci light in camp, here is what I use and find to be more than adequate in camp.





Shown: Battery bank, folding 14w solar panel, Li-ion battery pack and removable cells, USB fan, shorty mag, normal mag AA (in for size comparison), Li-Ion (800+ lumens to moonlight mode) lumen flashlight - also powers the lantern as shown, two Goal Zero USB lights, USB charger.

Since solar panels are grossly inefficient (14-18% typical power conversion rates) even on the best of days (bright sun, cool temps, panels at the right angle all day) Extra wattage is always recommend on the panels (easy for car camping or base camp, couple extra people, etc ) and extra on your battery bank.

Goal Zero solar panels and battery packs are slick but by various testing has shown not to perform very highly (and I have several generations of their equipment, so am a believer in the product) - if you can run Li-Ion, your battery capacity (to run a charger or USB) will be greatly increased. I don't find the Luci to have enough power to setup or cook at night or for long nights (I do mostly 3 season camping now, skipping the summers), but have a smaller light that doubles as a 15 - 800 lumen lantern area light and also can be super bright flashlight in 2 seconds (Seeker - would pick out the most crafty bruin at some distance).

On shorter trips now, I am just taking an extra flashlight battery or two and maybe a second, smaller USB battery bank. That has been enough to throw a charge on the cell phone (typically turned off anyway, charge up the Mp3 player, mini-speaker and maybe one of the two flashlight batteries.).

Given two extended power outages at home during Hurricanes Irene and Sandy, I really tested out my stuff alot more and over extended days and hours than I would have expected.

 

[Guest]

Sweeper, I have watched that video several times. Those hanging glow globes are too freaking cool, maybe the best thing yet with (?) old barrel staves.

Those have mass market backyard appeal.

 

[sweeper]

Thanks Mike, the video doesn't come close to how nice it is to sit under them with a beer and a cigar. Their only problem is, they don't translate well during a daylight show, just a metal ball with a lot of wire. At one point I had 14 around the yard, those sold very quickly, but mostly one here one there. This 'array' is an attempt to sell a bunch of them all at once. My boss is really excited, I just need to shoot a good video.
But first we are going to 'Southshore' of MA this weekend to an Irish Festival. We've built a bar from the barrel stave and hosting a Jameson Whiskey tasting while we sell chairs and bar stools. Then we'll work on the video.

 

[MagicPaddler]

Just reading through this thread and see the discussion addressing 2 situations. I would call them car camping and wilderness camping. For wilderness camping if you are using batteries to recharge batteries there will be a loss in the process so only use this where the battery being recharged is difficult or expensive to use a spare.
I see Eneloop NiMH being used good brand but yesterday’s chemistry. If you got them use them until their capacity gets too low but when it comes time to replace them look elsewhere. I see where 8 Eneloop batteries are used in series. These batteries put out most of their energy between 1.2 and 1.3 Volts. So if you are using 8 of these in series you are operating your device (fan) on about 10 volts. If the device (fan) is operating satisfactory then you would be looking for a replacement battery bank that would supply 10 volts. I would suggest Li-ion batteries in the 18650 package with a built in protection PCB and button top.
Why this battery type? It is not the most power dense but is one of the more power dense types of battery. It is the battery used to build some of the battery banks for cars and computers. It can be bought with the protection built in and a button top for hassle free use.
So how do I use Li-ion 18650 batteries? These batteries put out most of their energy between 3.3 and 4 volts. Connect 3 of these batteries in series will provide power between 9.9 and 12 volts replacing 8 MiMH batteries. If your device requires 12 volts put 4 in series.
So how long will 3 18650 batteries run my device (fan)? That depends on which 18650 batteries you buy. WORD OF CAUTION There are a lot of cheap mislabeled batteries out there so stick with the name brands. I use Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAH with protection and button top. I have tested these and they really do put out 3400mAH at light loads so this is what I will make comparisons with. Three of the Panasonic batteries will run your fan 1.7 times as long as 8 new Eneloop NiMh AA batteries. These batteries can be purchased on ebay for less than $6.50 US each.
So how do I charge Li-ion batteries? The NCR18650 batteries can be charged in 3 or 4 hours with the correct charges but if you don’t need that speed stick with the slower, cheaper, and better for the battery chargers. Lots of chargers are available on ebay some run on either 120 volts or a car battery.

 

[Chip]

I have the same O2 fan, which I have operated with D cells. I only used it once and I ran it all night, and it still seems to operate fine. Anybody have any idea how many nights I can get with 8 D cells? If I read these charts correctly, it seems a D cell has about 8 times the mAh as an AA battery. So if Willie gets one night from his AAs, will the Ds last all week?

For truck camping, it seems obvious we should just borrow from the sailing community their solar/battery powered ventilation systems, something like the Nicro Day/Night Vent. I worry about 70+mph, wind-blown, rain. But sailors stuck in storms deal with conditions like that, so the vents must deal with it. I've more or less decided to install one or two of these in my truck cap, but have not pulled the trigger on it. I'd like to see and handle one before I buy. I meant to go to the sail boat show last time it was in Annapolis so I could look at these, but think I went paddling instead. Besides reluctance to cut holes in the cap, another thing that concerns me is that when I am off truck camping, there frequently is a boat on the roof, and it seems like the boat would reduce the amount of solar charging (solution=take boat off, go paddle).

Ideally, I'd like a system where the solar cells can be put somewhere apart from the fan. The fan could be mounted in the cap, but the solar cells could be mounted on both sides of the cap or on the hood. But I think that means it'd have to be a DIY build and I may not find time for that.

 

[MagicPaddler]

Chip
Willies batteries are NiMH AA’s which have a capacity of about 1800mAH. I assume the D cell you are talking about are Alkaline. I have measured Energizer D cells and found they put out 14000mAH between 1.6 volts and 1 volt. That would give you 7.7 times as much current but it will probably not run the same fan for 7.7 times as long. The alkaline batteries are higher voltage so the fan will run faster. I would estimate the fan would run about 6.5 times as long on the D cells.

 

[Will Derness]

.........Bought a female adaptor, which I wired to plug into an AGM rechargeable battery (10,000 mah, from Cabelas, about 4x2x8 inches). Runs the fan for at least 4 nights on high speed setting. I

I like how this thread has evolved, I'm learning stuff. Connectors have always been a bewildering, head scratching thing for me. So how does the female adaptor plug into the AGM battery? The AGM batteries see on line all have positive / negative posts? I'm guessing with your fan only needing 4 D cells, your power needs are half of mine.

CHIP
"If I read these charts correctly, it seems a D cell has about 8 times the mAh as an AA battery."

So the trade off for lighter weight and rechargeability is vastly decreased storage capacity.

MAGIC_PADDLER
'I would estimate the fan would run about 6.5 times as long on the D cells."

It is so nice to have someone on board who can work the problem.

The 18650 batteries you talked about sound promising, but then the connector issue arises. They won't easily drop into the fan's battery case. I have the 12V cigarette power adaptor for the fan that Greg mentioned so crafting a female connector to a rechargeable battery seems the best solution for my situation.

USB powers packs out put at 5V, so not a good solution, correct? Does there exist a rechargeable D cell battery that has ~~15,000mah capacity? That would be the bulls eye solution.

Or I can just suck it up and buy single use D cells.

 

[MagicPaddler]

As far as having the correct connector on a new type of battery to fit any older equipment it is not likely. There are some options for connecting up batteries. Go to ebay and search for “18650 battery holder” and you will see a bunch. People put those in a small plastic case hole drilled to let the wires go through then wire them directly to their equipment. I make my own battery holders that are light, water resistant, and snap in to clips mounted inside my canoe for use with a fish detector. I describe this battery holder on another site at the following link.
http://bwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=forum.thread&threadId=964239&forumID=15&confID=1

 

[southcove]

When Radio Shack could be accessed by many with a 5 minute drive to the store...experiment away! Shame about that, but so much of those needed odds and ends are readily available, as noted on ebay or amazon, but patience and planning is called for.

I run/ran several small AGMs with a simple 12v adaptor or extension cord w female end and just soldered up alligator clips for the two battery terminals. I can run safely (the cord is fused) 12v radio, 12 cooler, 12 LED lights, 12v boat fan, 12v battery charger, 12v margarita mixer blender (man must have his pleasures among all the other deprivations!). To charge up I had the weekly run into town for shower and shave and groceries as well as some trickle effect from two 15 watt panels (not much sunlight on that mtn). Other folks in that off-grid area had small to substantial generators and impressive battery banks.

The one way that no one has mentioned is to buy one of the Li-Ion jump start packs online or from Lowes, etc. They can actually start a car with a dead battery and have the 12v alligator clips handy to mate up with your needs. I do not understand that part of the circuitry, so not sure if it would just boost or you could run a low draw usage *(or you can use them easily if you are USB connected, short or long term). But the wiring is done for you and prices are down to $75-100.

Someone handy like MagicPaddler could always set up a battery bank w the more powerful 26650 or even the mightier 32650 Li-Ion batteries, typically offering 5000+ mAh and hundreds of reliable charge cycles. For my needs during the warmer months my camp set up as noted above is way more than I typically need or take with me.

Alkalines and NiMh...be gone!

PS Chip - how about just wiring a 12v accessory cord w adaptor into your truck cap, fused and lay out a 12v solar panel w enough cord to maximize gain during the time you are there-direct to the truck battery, (most of those would have a charge controller and fuse built in). You'd want to experiment in your driveway at home to see how much your fan drew off the truck battery overnight or buy a simple meter and just monitor the battery level while in the field (but a simple 12v tractor battery for $45 from Wallyworld would still be my first choice for your total peace of mind).

 

[Guest]

I like how this thread has evolved, I'm learning stuff.

Me too. It is interesting to see that lots of folks have approached the question of power in the field and found different solutions.

I am still as confused as every about the best power source to run a truck bed fan for a week or more, but more convinced than ever that there is a KISS solution.

 

[southcove]

I am still as confused as every about the best power source to run a truck bed fan for a week or more, but more convinced than ever that there is a KISS solution.

My thoughts only, from the KISS POV... 12v fan from marine or RV supply. 12V lawn tractor battery, 12v solar panel to top off battery with, female cigarette power end cord w alligator clips and fuse to hook to 12 battery.

Plenty of left over juice to run a 12v LED light for area or reading. Your fan would be wired to a male cigarette power plug w a fuse. You could also always top off your tractor battery if you were running the truck.

Not elegant but proven in my usage off the grid.

 

[Guest]

More fan and lighting stuff

A couple of packages arrived. Try this gifts from friends.

Joel sent me this fan:

https://www.amazon.com/Bengoo-Porta...473606674&sr=8-1&keywords=bengoo+portable+fan

That little fan is charging now. We shall see, it could be part of my tripping truck cap air circulation solution.

And DougD sent me a couple of these LED light units.

https://www.amazon.com/Promier-PSWI...sr=8-1&keywords=promier+cordless+light+switch

Those are another a tripping truck item. The cap “dome” light is useless to me. I didn’t want it wired directly to the battery for a number of reasons, so I need to turn the ignition and truck lights on for that dome light to work. And when I do use it the light is an upside down blind fumble feel for the recessed button “switch”.

The little Promier light-switch thing is bright as heck. And it has a tactile familiar switch which is easy to find in the dark. I like it.

It has Velcro, magnets and a screwhead slot on the back. I was wondering how to mount it but didn’t actually need to. The bedrail inside the cap has a 3 inch horizontal lip on both sides. A carpeted lip. The Velcro on the back of the light sticks to that carpet quite firmly. Actually the entire cap interior is carpeted, cap walls and roof and all of the built in storage boxes as well. I could pretty much stick that “light switch” LED anywhere in the back of the truck.

I like it a lot. Now I’m thinking of where to mount the second one. Maybe the tool & tractor shed, which has no light or electricity, or the dark linen closet in the hall.

Nah, I’m bringing both of them in the truck. I bet I find a place for the second one.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Those LED lights on a switch.. would be handy for the trailers "basement". Its a dark hole in there. Would be useful for a hinged wanigan at night too.

Come to think of it my paddleshack needs illuminating. Off to Amazon. Thank goodness for Prime

 

[Guest]

Those LED lights on a switch.. would be handy for the trailers "basement". Its a dark hole in there. Would be useful for a hinged wanigan at night too.

Come to think of it my paddleshack needs illuminating. Off to Amazon. Thank goodness for Prime

I believe Doug actually found those at the Dollar Store check out. Not for a dollar, but I am smitten with the bright illumination (don’t look directly at it) and the familiar light-switch feel for midnight blind grasping.

The shed/storage/truck bed/closet/etc applications are nearly endless.

I could, and do, just as easily leave a small LED flashlight in all those dark of view places. And then too often misplace it or walk away with it in my pocket.

 

[Chip]

I did some looking around on the net and some reflection on my needs.

I camped out of my truck 30 or 40 nights last year. I never used the fan. I've only needed the fan once, when I was foolish enough to go camping in July near Charleston, SC. Whew, hot! I did spend a few uncomfortable nights when rain forced me to close up while in the cap. Rain and bugs are the reasons I'd like to have a through-the-cap vent that could operate when the cap is closed.

I've never camped out of my truck while it was parked for a week. Usually, I'm driving every day or two. Neither the O2 fan nor an LED light are going to drain the truck battery if it is frequently being driven and recharged.

I occasionally remove my cap and use the truck for truck stuff. Therefore, a self-contained fan-battery-charger, installed in the cap, has great appeal. When the cap is on, the fan would just be there, and there would be no need for connectors or wiring.

I liked the sail-boat vents because they were an all in one solution. Solar charger, battery, and a fan that could be installed through the cap. But I can't imagine it would work in the shadows of a boat on the roof. Thus the idea of separating the solar chargers and mounting them somewhere else. There goes the all-in-one solution, and I'd have to run wires.

If I'm running wires, I think I should just run a wire from the battery and connect it to either cig-lighter sockets in the truck bed (like Greg did) or an empty slot in the connection block for the cap (runs brake and dome light). I could use the former to run the O2 fan or the latter to wire a through-the-cap fan. Hopefully, I'll make it to the sailboat show in October and see what they have for through-hull fans, and how much power they use.

I've never been on a week-long canoe camper where I needed a fan. I have a PocketJuice power pack to keep my iphone charged, which of late is also my camera and gps. Beyond the iphone, the only electronics I carry are VHF radio, a luci light and a headlamp with spare AAAs. The VHF battery lasts a long time unless I transmit a lot, which is not my tendency. So, I think I'm okay for power in the field.

 

[southcove]

I like this little system for quick set up & utility - proven off grid, long term and nighttime set up (when car camping). 25' extension cord w battery clips and cigarette lighter style power receptacle. 10' coiled extension cord. Doubler adaptor. (all fused). 12v or USB LED lights 100-300 lumen, which are chainable for additional units if needed.

We recently used this for a large park picnic gathering where gas lanterns were not allowed and it went hours w almost no discernable draw on the car battery (4 3W lights and a 12v radio). Off a spare outlet I can use a USB adaptor, battery charger, etc and works just fine with my little solar panels.

 

[sweeper]

Some more Solar in my field, just turned it on this morning.

https://vimeo.com/190799464