I'm new to this site and have a question for the experts here. I've owned traditional canoes in the past. My first was a Mad river fiberglass back in the 80's. I currently have an Old Town 146 Saranac. It's a bit heavy and too awkward for me to load on my vehicle anymore. I have had several back surgeries and want a lighter canoe. I'm looking at the Adirondack Canoe Company Boreas with the traditional seating position or the Hornbeck Classic 14 with their floor seating position. I do plan on testing paddling both boats out. I was wondering if the folks here could advise me whether one seating position over the other is more comfortable for someone with chronic back pain. My intended use would be 2-3 day fishing/camping trips with portages in the Adirondacks of upstate NY. Possibly with longer trips into Algonquin park again if my back holds out. Thanks for any advice you fine folks can offer.
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Bad back and purchasing a new lightweight canoe
- Thread starter TimJ
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Think it would be solely your choice depending on you back but a traditional seat would offer more options for changing positions for relief….sitting, kneeling, one or two legs under the seat…seems like a floor mount would lock you into one position. Also getting up from the floor is not the easiest thing to do (at least for me) and that may be a strain on your back…test paddle! Really all depends on what your back can handle comfortably I think.
Thanks for your response stevet. That's what I thought. I've always been able to move my seating position and even kneel when necessary to relieve my back pain. I never tried the pack canoe seating. I've only heard from another paddler that being in that position is acceptable for short periods of time. I never even thought about getting off the floor. That could be an issue after a few hours in that position.
Tim,
Welcome to the site!
My Darling Bride has a Swift pack canoe, with a bottom mounted seat.
While she loves it, I find it comfortable for only the 1st five minutes, after that, the limited positions and stretched out legs become quite bothersome.
My solo boats have pedestal mounted seats, I can fit one or both feet under me, kneel with one foot under the seat and the other in the bilge, or kneel with both feet under the seat. Waaay more comfortable, and a large variety of positioning options.
Oh, and the pack canoe seating forces you to use a kayak paddle, and along with that come constant drips into the boat.
By all means, definitely test paddle any prospects before you commit, and not just for a five minute jaunt.
You might also consider one of the Slipstream offerings...
Welcome to the site!
My Darling Bride has a Swift pack canoe, with a bottom mounted seat.
While she loves it, I find it comfortable for only the 1st five minutes, after that, the limited positions and stretched out legs become quite bothersome.
My solo boats have pedestal mounted seats, I can fit one or both feet under me, kneel with one foot under the seat and the other in the bilge, or kneel with both feet under the seat. Waaay more comfortable, and a large variety of positioning options.
Oh, and the pack canoe seating forces you to use a kayak paddle, and along with that come constant drips into the boat.
By all means, definitely test paddle any prospects before you commit, and not just for a five minute jaunt.
You might also consider one of the Slipstream offerings...
Thanks for your input and your welcome stripperguy. I like that folks here are willing to share their experiences with the different seating positions. A search on duckduckgo doesn't offer much help. I also noticed that most pack boats only offer the kayak style seating. So an ultralight solo is likely the way I'll need to go. Adirondack Canoe company's Boreas are very similar in hull shape and weight to the Swift canoe I was looking at. But, better fits my budget.
i have three Hornbeck canoes. I acquired them exclusively for backcountry bushwhack travel through the wilderness off trail, pond to pond, where they excel. Which I have done a lot over many years, including on a 185 mile trip diagonally across the Adirondacks in a15 pound 10.5' Lost Pond Hornbeck. I am not crazy about the floor mounted foam seat which does not allow for much variety on how my legs have to be positioned. I also have never cared for using a kayak paddle in a canoe, which is necessary with low floor mounted seats, although I know some folks do like to paddle with them in more traditional canoes. Otherwise, all of my solo canoes have regular off the floor level seats, some mounted higher than others because I am a single blade paddler and paddling from the high seat position is more effective and efficient for me to both cruise on open water at speed and for fine control maneuvering (fun) where necessary.
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I agree that the traditional seating position will be easier on your back for all the reasons already mentioned. When kneeling your spine is basically straight and vertical vs being in a 90 degree bend when sitting. Having your weight distributed between your butt and knees helps comfort a lot...I can go for hours kneeling but not sitting with all my weight on my butt.
my back is an absolute mess with fractured vertebrae, ruptured discs, and severed nerves, I personally find that pedestals or tractor seats are absolute misery after about 10 minutes and prefer a contoured, sliding, gunwale- mounted bench seat to be the cat's meow- you can change both the height and angle by altering the length of the slider rail drops (mine are threaded rod with wood bushings), the sliders allow you to shift fore or aft on the fly, the contoured front edge means that when sitting or kneeling it doesn't cut into your thighs, and the ability to shift from side to side allows for trimming for an off balance load or leaning the boat to paddle "Canadian" style, I also have an added kneeling thwart added which has about a 3" drop and is angled down a few degrees to act as a toe brace for balance and to help relieve torque and pressure on my lower back- it and the canted seat means I can literally lock my lower body in position for more power in nasty conditions
when sitting your back is not at a 90 degree bend, your legs are- your back can't bend that much so you rotate at the hips...
I can't kneel for more than a few minutes.
By all means get yourself a light kevlar canoe. Then put it on a trailer you can back into the water.
I find a higher seat to be more comfortable for me, as far as my back goes. In the last boat I bought the seats were about 9.5", I raised them to 11.5 and it was much better for my back. Maybe not as nice as the 14" ones in my wood canvas boats, but high enough to allow me to get my feet under to relieve stress on the low back.
I got myself a 40# Bell Seliga Tripper and I like it for solo or tandem.
I got myself a 40# Bell Seliga Tripper and I like it for solo or tandem.
@TimJ we have a member on this site (@NoelCanoeDad) who is a dealer of slipstream boats. Might be worth reaching out to him. I know he accommodates test paddles/demos.
All good points. I do tend to kneel about 40% of the time. I'll add a small exercise mat similar to the one Jason Irwin uses in his videos. I find the traditional seats kill my butt and translate to more back pain after a long time paddling. I'll like to see what your kneeling thwart looks like if you don't mind sharing a picture of yours.
I was looking at a Carbon fiber canoe. Kevlar is an option for the hull design I like. I will be portaging the canoe and won't have an issue with loading a small one on my roof rack.
That's a beautiful canoe. Even though my old Mad river was a heavy fiberglass canoe. I did like the seating positions better than the OT 146 Saranac I currently have. Thanks for your advice on seat height.
Thank you Jmharrick. I'll look into Slipstream boats.
I purchased my new canoe carrier last month. I put the crossbars on it last night. Next up will be the new composite solo canoe. 
Tim,
I see you're right down the road from me...sort of.
I'm in Colonie, 45 minutes from the Blue Line.
Let's hear about your favorite ADK paddling/camping spots. Nothing secretive or hidden gems, but the usual stuff.
Maybe even in a new thread.
I see you're right down the road from me...sort of.
I'm in Colonie, 45 minutes from the Blue Line.
Let's hear about your favorite ADK paddling/camping spots. Nothing secretive or hidden gems, but the usual stuff.
Maybe even in a new thread.
Hey Tim,
I have a bad back too, throw in two junky shoulders. I didn’t catch your size, but part of your criteria should include the durability necessary for your paddling. UL Kevlar is fine if lakes are all you paddle, just get a boat that will hold you and your gear, and is sea worthy. If rocky rivers are on your list, you might consider the expedition Kevlar from Swift. I love my Prospector 14. At 41 lbs, it’s my heaviest canoe, but I can handle it. Kevlar’s also easy to repair.
My tripper is a Northstar Magic in UL Kevlar, but it may be a tad tippy for your taste. It handles me, my gear and dog for the trips you describe. Last winter while rehabbing my shoulder and back, I got a really light (29lb) Blacklite Phoenix. It was a mistake. I love the hull design, but it’s impractical or not ideal for all but a local reservoir backwater; too delicate for local streams, too responsive, low capacity for bigger water and tripping - but man is it easy to load and carry. I’ll either sell it or bash it up anyway.
So, I’d recommend a Kevlar boat, ultra light if you’re just doing lakes or larger streams, thicker Kevlar for other waters.
I have a bad back too, throw in two junky shoulders. I didn’t catch your size, but part of your criteria should include the durability necessary for your paddling. UL Kevlar is fine if lakes are all you paddle, just get a boat that will hold you and your gear, and is sea worthy. If rocky rivers are on your list, you might consider the expedition Kevlar from Swift. I love my Prospector 14. At 41 lbs, it’s my heaviest canoe, but I can handle it. Kevlar’s also easy to repair.
My tripper is a Northstar Magic in UL Kevlar, but it may be a tad tippy for your taste. It handles me, my gear and dog for the trips you describe. Last winter while rehabbing my shoulder and back, I got a really light (29lb) Blacklite Phoenix. It was a mistake. I love the hull design, but it’s impractical or not ideal for all but a local reservoir backwater; too delicate for local streams, too responsive, low capacity for bigger water and tripping - but man is it easy to load and carry. I’ll either sell it or bash it up anyway.
So, I’d recommend a Kevlar boat, ultra light if you’re just doing lakes or larger streams, thicker Kevlar for other waters.
Owen Pond was one of my favorite portages and fishing trips with my canoe in the lake placid area. It is a hard trail going up non stop all the way to the pond. I'm not sure I could even make that trail with a ultra weight canoe now. When I was much younger we spent a lot of time at Putnam Pond and hiked out from there to Barrymill pond, Rock Pond , Clear pond and Grizzly ocean. I stopped portaging/canoe trips for the past 15 years as I have had multiple back surgeries. I only purchased my OT 146 Saranac for the Schoharie reservoir. Once washed and on the reservoir the boat can't be moved without going through the whole process every time you remove it from the launch area. I hit a mid life crisis and had the need for speed so my last vehicle was a Ford Mustang. I traded that in for the Bronco a week ago. So, a new canoe is in my near future. I'll start with small ponds around my area until I get the feel for it and venture out from there. I'd like to take a trip to Algonquin park again for brook trout fishing. Maybe next summer.
