Making a Seat

[Roybrew]

I am building a seat for a canoe I'm getting ready to start building. I'm thinking about building the Raven. I want a solo canoe and this design has been highly spoken of.

I've cut out a rough idea on a scrap piece. Is the seat area to large? I figured 22" wide with a 2" drop. Just getting my ideas together.
Appreciate any advice.
Roy

 

[Cruiser]

I make my seats as wide as the canoe lets me, take the width at seat location and allow ~3" at each side for the connection (Hang or cleats). This leaves lots of adjust ability for trimming to fit.

Assuming that pic from scraps is just for the shape you are planing, you certainly don't want the seat cut that way ... your best bet is bending strips to that shape to avoid all of those grain transitions, which will create a series of weak points.

Also, if you drop the front ~2" and then drop the back about 1" you create a natural cant forward, which helps get rid of that seat ridge that flat seats create on the back of your legs when you stretch out your legs.


Brian

 

[Jim Dodd]

Every builder comes up with their own design
Mine have about 1" drop in the center, and much narrower arc, than yours.
The width of the arc, is roughly the width of my bottom, say 18"- 20"
I want enough room, so I can set my portage yoke, comfortably, between the seat and gunnels, of my solos.

I'm at home now, I'll go to the shop and take some measurements, if I haven't already posted them.

The important thing, is you make them comfortable for you !

 

[Roybrew]

I make my seats as wide as the canoe lets me, take the width at seat location and allow ~3" at each side for the connection (Hang or cleats). This leaves lots of adjust ability for trimming to fit.

Assuming that pic from scraps is just for the shape you are planing, you certainly don't want the seat cut that way ... your best bet is bending strips to that shape to avoid all of those grain transitions, which will create a series of weak points.

Also, if you drop the front ~2" and then drop the back about 1" you create a natural cant forward, which helps get rid of that seat ridge that flat seats create on the back of your legs when you stretch out your legs.


Brian

Thanks Brian. I'm wanting to build the Raven by John Winters. The max width states 32.25". I haven't ordered the plans yet, but I think the 22" curve should be good, and leave at least 5" on each side for hanging and adjusting. So the front of the seat being dropped an inch more then the back is more comfortable? I don't kneel unless I encounter rough water. I've never steam bent wood before either. That'll be a new endeavor. I was going to laminate some cherry and black walnut for my seat frame.
Thank you
Roy

 

[Roybrew]

Every builder comes up with their own design
Mine have about 1" drop in the center, and much narrower arc, than yours.
The width of the arc, is roughly the width of my bottom, say 18"- 20"
I want enough room, so I can set my portage yoke, comfortably, between the seat and gunnels, of my solos.

I'm at home now, I'll go to the shop and take some measurements, if I haven't already posted them.

The important thing, is you make them comfortable for you !

That would be awesome Jim. Thank you. Is your seat lower in the front then the back? Just curious on your thoughts of a cantered seat like Brian mentioned. It sounds like it may be easier on my knees.
Roy

 

[Jim Dodd]

I just returned from the shop.

Put the tape to my seats. The drop at center is 1", the width is 16" . I think you would be more comfortable, with a wider seat. at least 18".

I agree with Brian, on lowering the front edge. 3/4" is where I set mine. That can be adjusted after the fact.
Two things. I like to set my seats on the low side. It's easier to raise a seat, than to lower it, and need to make different brackets.
Finally I often add a thin pad, for warmth and comfort, especially when paddling a long time, or in cooler weather.

For a solo portage yoke, I like the Bell design, and incorporated it into my yokes.

and here as a backrest.

I've not built a Raven, but I had an impromptu race with one. My Pearl won.

Having said that ? Many like the Raven, and it should serve you well !

Looking forward to your build!

Jim

 

[Cruiser]

Thanks Brian. I'm wanting to build the Raven by John Winters. The max width states 32.25". I haven't ordered the plans yet, but I think the 22" curve should be good, and leave at least 5" on each side for hanging and adjusting. So the front of the seat being dropped an inch more then the back is more comfortable? I don't kneel unless I encounter rough water. I've never steam bent wood before either. That'll be a new endeavor. I was going to laminate some cherry and black walnut for my seat frame.
Thank you
RoyView attachment 135238

Think of the angle formed by your legs to the bottom of the canoe, when you stretch them out .... by canting the seat and lowering that front, the seat aligns with the angle of the legs and so pressure on any spot (i.e back of the leg) is avoided.

Covered the seat and steam bending in the last build https://www.canoetripping.net/threads/light-weight-solo-tripper-build.105054/page-9

and I did walnut cherry trim on the Kipawa I did a few years ago, here is a pic that may give you a better visual, only issye I have with walnut/cherry combo is that walnut fades with time and cherry darkens, the contrast gets lost and it starts to just look dirty/smudgy

 

[Roybrew]

Thanks for your time Jim. I appreciate you measuring that.

I'm thinking about the Raven. Not dead set on it yet, but one thing for certain, which ever I build better be under 35" wide or my seat won't fit. Buying the cart before the horse.

Got my walnut and cherry strips cut. The walnut I cut to 1/8" x 1 1/2". The cherry strips are 1/4" by 1 1/2". Cherry seems to bend better then black walnut. I need to make my bending jig, another thing I've never done.

Portage yoke?? Naw, maybe I can get my wife to carry it for me. Sherpa service?
Roy

 

[Roybrew]

Think of the angle formed by your legs to the bottom of the canoe, when you stretch them out .... by canting the seat and lowering that front, the seat aligns with the angle of the legs and so pressure on any spot (i.e back of the leg) is avoided.

Covered the seat and steam bending in the last build https://www.canoetripping.net/threads/light-weight-solo-tripper-build.105054/page-9

and I did walnut cherry trim on the Kipawa I did a few years ago, here is a pic that may give you a better visual, only issye I have with walnut/cherry combo is that walnut fades with time and cherry darkens, the contrast gets lost and it starts to just look dirty/smudgy

View attachment 135240

Ooh I never thought about wood color changing like that. Wow I've already cut out the strip too. Oh well, I sure ain't getting any prettier also.

Is that the Kipawa in the picture? Very nice. I'll check out the link to your build.

I'm hoping the cantered seat will be easier on my knees. I've made 4 seats so far. They were all flat seats.
This is the black walnut seat in my Wabnaki. I weaved them a plastic cane looking stuff. Very little to no stretch. I wonder if natural cane would be more comfortable.
Roy

 

[carpenter]

I would worry that the deeper arc would force your thighs into the centre, less lateral movement possible. Better more elliptical rather than circular curve?

 

[Cruiser]

I would worry that the deeper arc would force your thighs into the centre, less lateral movement possible. Better more elliptical rather than circular curve?

Although I do agree at some point, as the radius decreases, the depth could cause a "sliding to the middle" effect ... however, given the mechanics of the area, it would be pretty difficult to do that in this case.
Using this shallow of an arc, I suspect the difference between the elipse shape and the circular shape would be pretty hard to distinguish.

RB ... another point to think about for your intended shape, if you try to make that sharp bend at each side with 1/4" strips, your chance of a bending failure (cracking the strip) will be quite high. Thinner strips may be something to consider.

Brian

 

[Roybrew]

Jumped in and took a dive at it. 1st time steaming anything. I couldn't find my other half of my make shift form, so I just started throwing the clamps to the part I had. I'll do better next time and have a better form. One rung at a time.Slathered the glue on and then about 20 more clampsI had a little side slide with the glue strips, but it was manageable. I think it'll work. Maybe 1 and 3/4 inch drop. If it doesn't work out it was a fun learning experience.
Roy

 

[Cruiser]

Just a note on that, the non bent parts are just spacers and bear low load, so they don't actually need to be a glue up

 

[Roybrew]

Just a note on that, the non bent parts are just spacers and bear low load, so they don't actually need to be a glue up

Yep, I already glued them things up anyhow. Maybe I'll get it done in a few days. I'll tell you what tho, nothing smells better then steaming walnut and cherry

 

[Jim Dodd]

A good thing to do, is to mortise your frames.

I throw a wood screw in the joint, but it really isn't needed.

Oh By the way, I have, and still use my Craftsman 10" band saw, just like yours.

It is so handy for cutting bevels on strip ends.

Jim

 

[Roybrew]

A good thing to do, is to mortise your frames.

I throw a wood screw in the joint, but it really isn't needed.

Oh By the way, I have, and still use my Craftsman 10" band saw, just like yours.

It is so handy for cutting bevels on strip ends.

Jim

That little Craftsman bandsaw has served me well. I need to replace the rubber on the drive wheels.

I did a 1/4" mortice like what your picture shows. Glued the joint and run in a good quality deck screw.
Thanks for the advice
Roy

 

[Roybrew]

It has been raining here all day, so it was a good day to finish the seat.



Not my best weaving job, but I'm happy with it. Going to put this one on my Mohawk solo 13. I'll make another one when I finish building the Raven canoe. This is fun stuff. I'm tired right now.
Roy

 

[Roybrew]

The seat didn't break, and is comfortable. I do need to raise it a little and raise the back side more then the front. I maybe could've bolted it to the gunnels, but I set it on the original aluminum brackets.Stock seat on the left.
Very happy with the results. Thank you all for your advice and input.
Roy

 

[Cruiser]

so it's a win-win-win .... more comfortable, is strong enough and looks so much better

Great job