Drilling Into Aluminum Gunwale?

[boy&hisdogs]

I have a Clipper canoe with hollow, slightly rounded aluminum gunwales (see image). I have things I want to mount to the gunwale, namely a set of outriggers.



Can I drill and bolt/rivet to these without ruining them? Everything in the canoe is mounted on brackets riveted to the hull, nothing from the factory is mounted to the gunwales and that makes me worry that I won't be able to.

This is what the mounts look like.

 

[Rippy]

I'm not feeling good about it myself. If you bolted through the hollow part it would collapse some when you tighten the bolt. I feel the material is too thin to hold a rivet with any up pressure (I think it would eventually pull through). Good luck and welcome to CT.

 

[Mason]

I have a Clipper WW3 (18'6", 73#) with aluminum gunwales on which I through-bolted my central carrying yoke (prob 10-32), through the hollow channel. I did this shortly after I purchased it in 1994 or so. I've portaged it miles and miles with no ill effect. During installation, I did collapse the gunwale slightly (too tight on the C-clamps while determining where to mount the thwart--didn't want it to fall on my head. IU doubt you'll have problems if you're careful.

 

[boy&hisdogs]

The other thing I was considering was adding brackets just under the gunwales like the factory mounts. It will be as high as possible on the hull, above the water line and I can silicon the rivets.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Boy&hisdogs, welcome to site membership! Feel free to ask any questions and to post messages, photos and videos, and to start threads, in our many forums. Please read Welcome to CanoeTripping and Site Rules! Also, please add your location to the Account Details page in your profile, which will cause it to show under your avatar, as this is a geographic sport. Many of the site's technical features are explained in Features: Help and How-To Running Thread. We look forward to your participation in our canoe community.

I have no experience with drilling or attaching to aluminum gunwales, but I do have experience with an outrigger because a Hawaiian outrigger canoe is part of my fleet. There will be constant and often considerable forces put on the outrigger-to-hull joint as the boat rocks in waves and is otherwise heeled to the side. Therefore, your choice of mounting to gunwales vs. brackets should take this kind of wear and tear into consideration.

 

[ppine]

Why would you want to add outriggers? The gunwales cannot take the strain of your mounts.

 

[boy&hisdogs]

Why would you want to add outriggers? The gunwales cannot take the strain of your mounts.

My wife and friends don't have good sea legs and are scared of rolling it. Admittedly so am I deep down. I'm comfortable on boats but generally have poor balance.

 

[Alan Gage]

What model of Clipper canoe is it?

I think the best answer is more seat time in the canoe. You'll get comfortable soon enough.

When the weather and water get warm intentionally capsize in shallow water. That will show you just how easy tipping the canoe is/isn't and will hopefully give you some more confidence. Many people get nervous with any slight side to side rocking but those movements are completely normal and the moment of capsize is usually still far off.

Alan

 

[Rippy]

Try kneeling with your bum resting against the seat. You'll find it feels allot more stable. If paddling solo sit in the bow and face the stern, you'll be closer to center and on a wider part of the canoe. Try Alan's advice so you can experience the secondary stability (when the canoe is leaning to the side). You'll find a point on most canoes where the resistance to rolling increases a bit.

 

[M Clemens]

The other thing I was considering was adding brackets just under the gunwales like the factory mounts. It will be as high as possible on the hull, above the water line and I can silicon the rivets.

Check out the yoke/thwart mounting hardware at Clipper or Wenonah. You could mount the brackets on the inside of the gunnels and then attach the outrigger mounts to the brackets, or just add a wood thwart and attach the outrigger brackets to the thwart.

 

[boy&hisdogs]

Check out the yoke/thwart mounting hardware at Clipper or Wenonah. You could mount the brackets on the inside of the gunnels and then attach the outrigger mounts to the brackets, or just add a wood thwart and attach the outrigger brackets to the thwart.
View attachment 140826

That's what I was thinking. Add a thwart then bolt the outrigger to that. They are not very big, nowhere near as big as traditional canoe ourtiggers and I won't be leaning on them all the time so I think it will be fine.

 

[boy&hisdogs]

What model of Clipper canoe is it?

I think the best answer is more seat time in the canoe. You'll get comfortable soon enough.

When the weather and water get warm intentionally capsize in shallow water. That will show you just how easy tipping the canoe is/isn't and will hopefully give you some more confidence. Many people get nervous with any slight side to side rocking but those movements are completely normal and the moment of capsize is usually still far off.

Alan

It's the 16'8" Cascade. Its a big flat bottomed tripping boat. When I'm in it by myself and kneeling or even seated with my brother we are perfectly fine. It's when I bring my non-outdoorsy friends that it becomes an issue.

You make an excellent point about intentionally capsizing to find it's limits. That's actually the first thing I did when I bought it. I took it for a short paddle in just a few feet of water and rolled it a few times to see what it could do.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

That's what I was thinking. Add a thwart then bolt the outrigger to that.

I assume a double outrigger system would ordinarily be attached across the center of the canoe. Is there not a central thwart already there? Is it wood or aluminum?

I also agree with the comments that suggest you should learn to paddle your canoe without outrigger stabilizers. Canoe paddling is a learned skill, just like bicycle riding, skiing and ice skating. The more you practice, the better you get, the more confident you feel, and the less likely you are to take a tumble. Eventually, it just becomes second nature.

The fears of inexperienced passengers are a different concern. Ways to deal with that include requiring that they all wear PFD's, that you only take them out on warm days in warm waters (unless protected by wetsuits or drysuits), that they all bring a change of clothes in a waterproof pack, and that you never go far from shore. All those guidelines apply to the most expert canoe paddlers, too.

 

[boy&hisdogs]

I assume a double outrigger system would ordinarily be attached across the center of the canoe. Is there not a central thwart already there? Is it wood or aluminum?

I also agree with the comments that suggest you should learn to paddle your canoe without outrigger stabilizers. Canoe paddling is a learned skill, just like bicycle riding, skiing and ice skating. The more you practice, the better you get, the more confident you feel, and the less likely you are to take a tumble. Eventually, it just becomes second nature.

The fears of inexperienced passengers are a different concern. Ways to deal with that include requiring that they all wear PFD's, that you only take them out on warm days in warm waters (unless protected by wetsuits or drysuits), that they all bring a change of clothes in a waterproof pack, and that you never go far from shore. All those guidelines apply to the most expert canoe paddlers, too.

All of the thwarts are round aluminum tube, and the yoke is fiberglass, molded into the hull, not a bolt-on like many of the other Clippers I have seen. It's ugly but surprisingly comfortable on the shoulders. My current idea is to mount a hardwood thwart on metal brackets just behind it and I can bolt the stabilizer mounts to that.

I agree that learning to paddle correctly is the right thing to do and since the outriggers I have chosen are easily detachable I will do so frequently. But, there will be some days that I would rather have the peace of mind.

 

[ppine]

Yes. Get over your fear by going out in warm shallow water. Capsize on purpose. Learn the limits of your boat. Learn to relax in a canoe or forget about paddling them and try a rowboat.