SOLO opinions... again please

I've been lurking and reading and searching and surfing and trying to make a final decision between not just a Northstar Northwind SOLO vs a Phoenix but between the Backlite layup and the IXP. I paddled both a week ago in the IXP layup. It was a super slow river with a slight wind. The NWS tracked better and the Phoenix turned better. But you all know that. I was encouraged to take the Phoenix in IXP because I had made the statement I might want to paddle class II on occasion. I picked it up over my head then picked up a NWS in Blacklite over my head. Again, as you know, big difference. However the Blacklite boat was already sold.
My details: I'm 72, weigh in at 225 and have 50 years of paddling experience. (yikes) I've owned everything from an 18 foot Mad River TW Special, a Jerry Stelmok E.M. White wood canvas and a birch bark canoe to an 11 pound Wee Lassie. I've just sold off everything heavy with the exception of our Mad River Explorer in kevlar. I'm looking for a solo boat that will fill the canoe needs the way a 4Runner has filled my four wheel needs since 1987. it just needs to do everything and I'll be happy. I would like it to roof rack easily, lake travel suitably, a bit of class I/II (mild class II) without drama and let me sneak into beaver ponds and smallish streams to fish.
With this being said, and you folks having owned or paddled them which hull and layup would you suggest? Is the Blacklite too fragile to be worth the light weight? Thanks for any help.

I've never paddled a Northstar canoe, so I can't comment on specific models. However, I can comment on general principles based on my experience with dozens of canoes, especially as I've now aged to 79.

First, age-related strength decreased and health issues rapidly accelerated in my 70s vs. my 60s. Therefore, at age 72, I would choose a solo canoe in the lightest layup I could afford. "Lasting a lifetime" for canoes and everything else has changed meaning dramatically.

Second, I would always prefer some turnabiity in a solo canoe rather than a hard tracking hull. That's because with my experience I can paddle virtually any canoe straight with single-sided correction strokes, and in older age I'm more interested in playing around in twisty creeks and smaller water venues than paddling straight ahead for miles in a racing or exercise or long-distance tripping canoe.

Third, although I've always primarily been a kneeler, I'd also like a solo that has sufficient stability for me to extricate my feet and paddle in various sitting positions for a change. Again, hull speed is now much lower on my priority scale.

Fourth, I have sufficient lifetime whitewater experience that I have no concern about paddling class 2 rapids in any hull material. I'm not going to hit much, even with my age-reduced skills. And so what if I get some scratches or eventually need some patches on a lightweight composite hull? My canoes are going nowhere that I know of after me.

Finally, composite canoe manufacturers such a Northstar (I assume) and Swift, Hemlock, Savage River, H2O and others offer several models that likely satisfy my principles above.

In sum, if I had age 72 to do over again, I'd look for a reasonably turnable, reasonably stable, 15' solo canoe that weighed no more than 30 lbs.

Thank you so much for your input. Only a couple of years into the 70s and I will agree with the your synopsis of the upcoming decade. My mountain biking has considerably slowed down and flattened out already. I paddled both boats with their seats in the dropped sitting position which made kneeling near impossible for a guy that spent forty years crawling across a sail loft floor building tents. I'll be on a kneeling drop seat whether kneeling or sitting. Apparently knees become uncooperative? I was hoping someone would start convincing me to go as light as possible and I promise to be easily swayed in that direction. In addition, having dodged a cancer bullet, I look at everything I purchase as most likely "lasting a lifetime" longer than me!

I've owned both Phoenix and NW Solo. Phoenix is a river boat that does pretty well on lakes and NW Solo is a lake boat that does pretty well on rivers. I agree that NW Solo tracks better but I don't care about that...Phoenix obeys the paddle. I paddle upstream on rivers so Phoenix lacks the efficiency that I like (I don't like the feeling of fighting the boat in addition to the current). If you cruise at 3 mph both are great. If you cruise at 4 mph Phoenix will suck a LOT more energy out of you. So I noticed that you made no comment about the efficiency of the boats you tried. I often use boats similar to NW Solo (Bell Merlin II, Swift Keewaydin 15). You can horse them around (especially if you kneel) and force them to turn pretty hard in rivers to avoid an obstacle or get on the right line but I've also experienced situations (like a long drop on fast water with obstacles) where I bump into stuff. I've also been pinned sideways on logs in current because you can't make a last minute u-turn. Phoenix is more fun playing on ponds...NW Solo isn't really a playful boat...it's an effective boat. NW Solo feels at home in high wind. Phoenix feels at home in high current (going downstream). I think both can handle your needs so you might lean towards whichever best fits the paddling you do the most. If you have other boats that perform best in certain situations maybe you choose the boat that's most different/complementary.

I think you want the Blacklite. They are not delicate, they are more sturdy than the Starlite used by rental fleets. I've hit rocks hard in my black/gold Bell with nothing worse than small gelcoat chips on the very nastiest hits. Blacklite has no gelcoat so it scuffs more easily and might need an occasional touch up if used hard. If you somehow manage to damage it in Class 2 it would be a small area and easily repaired...and you aren't likely to hit the same spot twice. If you have really shallow rivers full of sharp-edged rocks like some I've seen in Pennsylvania and New York maybe IXP makes sense for peace of mind, otherwise I don't think you want to lift and load an IXP boat 100% of the time just in case you need it for 1% (and perhaps 0%) of your situations.

Both are stable and friendly with no bad habits and can handle your weight (plus more) effortlessly. I'd suggest that you paddle them again and think about how much you value the maneuverability of the Phoenix versus the cruising efficiency of NW Solo.

I drive a 4Runner too and since Phoenix is basically a Prospector it may be the closest analogy to a 4Runner for doing everything...and getting you home when you go somewhere that you shouldn't.

I like to primary paddle streams but many times have to cross open water to get to the next stream, that’s why I chose the Northstar Trillium in Blacklite. The Phoenix will be slightly more maneuverable in streams but a constant correction on open water. Definitely go with Blacklite.

More words of wisdom and experience. Thank you. I'm sold on the Blacklite. I'll be lifting it on and off of the roof of my truck more than I'll be dodging rocks. I'm leaning toward the Phoenix. With my hoped for plan of smaller ponds and streams, medium size lake crossings and not very often multi day adventures I think the shorter, more maneuverable length will be appreciated more often. It didn't feel too tender to fish from and even that won't be hours at a time. I have a square stern Grumman for that. I don't have a dog to place in the bow and my cat won't accept my invitation to accompany me. Again, thank you for the input and opinions.

@Black_Fly's opinions on his Blacklite Phoenix should be informative to you, @Ivaduck.

I think I've read every Phoenix thread on this site. Folks are pretty happy with their boats. The river/stream in that thread is as flat as I'll never see here. We seem to always have wind and if not, we are looking at late summer and round, glacial river stones just under or at the surface, so nothing is runnable. When it's that low I don't want to be there anyway, that's what mountain bikes are for.
I put myself in line for a Phoenix in Blacklite with a hybrid kneeling seat and interior guards. I have a carbon foot brace that I'll install after some experimentation with paddling positions. Now the waiting begins. In the meantime I have dragged out an old fiberglass 16 footer (Northeast Canoes?) that was constructed from fiberglass with minimal cloth and resin but carbon fiber was added as individual ribs. This particular boat won the white water championships in the late '70s with someone else paddling it. I used it as a solo ww boat with a pedestal seat for years then converted it to a faux birchbark for reenacting in the Adirondacks for most of 25 years. At that time it had only carved thwarts so I used a bedroll to prop me into a comfortable kneeling position. In the middle of Lake George one exciting afternoon every carbon rib cracked sequentially with the sound of box spaghetti being broken. If it wasn't for my haversacks and bedroll compressing against the center thwart the boat would have folded in half. I'll be putting new wood gunnels in place and repairing some of the keel line where abrasion has taken its toll when muskets were following close behind. It should work well enough while I'm waiting.
Thanks again for all the help.

My BL Phoenix is still too new to imagine using it in a low flow situation, but some of the responses are encouraging. It would have shined in the flow I had in Wisconsin last week, but didn’t have it with me. That little river is a hull eater in mid-August. I’m checking flow on the LMR here in Ohio, which is normally a good royalex stream only.

Have you considered the North Wind solo in IXP?
I have two North Winds, a solo and a 17.
The North Wind is no whitewater boat, but I think you'd be surprised by how well it handles what might be called haystacks or wave trains.
You can get internal skid plates with the Blacklite, which I'd recommend. I hit a rock in my 17, while taking a photo, and it put a crack in the hull. No water was leaking in, but it did require some repair work. I can't remember for sure if I have internal skid plates on the 17.
If you do a lot of your canoeing on shallow, rocky rivers, I'd go with the IXP. Otherwise, Blacklite is great.
Just some things to consider.

Ivaduck said:

I've been lurking and reading and searching and surfing and trying to make a final decision between not just a Northstar Northwind SOLO vs a Phoenix but between the Backlite layup and the IXP. I paddled both a week ago in the IXP layup. It was a super slow river with a slight wind. The NWS tracked better and the Phoenix turned better. But you all know that. I was encouraged to take the Phoenix in IXP because I had made the statement I might want to paddle class II on occasion. I picked it up over my head then picked up a NWS in Blacklite over my head. Again, as you know, big difference. However the Blacklite boat was already sold.
My details: I'm 72, weigh in at 225 and have 50 years of paddling experience. (yikes) I've owned everything from an 18 foot Mad River TW Special, a Jerry Stelmok E.M. White wood canvas and a birch bark canoe to an 11 pound Wee Lassie. I've just sold off everything heavy with the exception of our Mad River Explorer in kevlar. I'm looking for a solo boat that will fill the canoe needs the way a 4Runner has filled my four wheel needs since 1987. it just needs to do everything and I'll be happy. I would like it to roof rack easily, lake travel suitably, a bit of class I/II (mild class II) without drama and let me sneak into beaver ponds and smallish streams to fish.
With this being said, and you folks having owned or paddled them which hull and layup would you suggest? Is the Blacklite too fragile to be worth the light weight? Thanks for any help.

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If I haven't answered before, here's what I think now. I'd be inclined to get the NW in Blacklite and get the internal skid plate option.
I don't think you could go too far wrong getting the Phoenix in Blacklite, but I'd probably give the nod to the NW. I've never taken my NW solo through any rapids, but I've taken my NW 17 through rapids and was very pleased with it's performance.
If you were younger, I might recommend the Phoenix in IXP, but not now.

I have a Phoenix in BL for sale. Not a good dog boat. Message me if interested.

Ivaduck said:

I've been lurking and reading and searching and surfing and trying to make a final decision between not just a Northstar Northwind SOLO vs a Phoenix but between the Backlite layup and the IXP. I paddled both a week ago in the IXP layup. It was a super slow river with a slight wind. The NWS tracked better and the Phoenix turned better. But you all know that. I was encouraged to take the Phoenix in IXP because I had made the statement I might want to paddle class II on occasion. I picked it up over my head then picked up a NWS in Blacklite over my head. Again, as you know, big difference. However the Blacklite boat was already sold.
My details: I'm 72, weigh in at 225 and have 50 years of paddling experience. (yikes) I've owned everything from an 18 foot Mad River TW Special, a Jerry Stelmok E.M. White wood canvas and a birch bark canoe to an 11 pound Wee Lassie. I've just sold off everything heavy with the exception of our Mad River Explorer in kevlar. I'm looking for a solo boat that will fill the canoe needs the way a 4Runner has filled my four wheel needs since 1987. it just needs to do everything and I'll be happy. I would like it to roof rack easily, lake travel suitably, a bit of class I/II (mild class II) without drama and let me sneak into beaver ponds and smallish streams to fish.
With this being said, and you folks having owned or paddled them which hull and layup would you suggest? Is the Blacklite too fragile to be worth the light weight? Thanks for any help.

Click to expand...

I’ve got a BL Phoenix which I bought because of the light weight, used during rehab from some bad injuries. I can’t imagine using it on rocky streams..